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  1. #1
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    Hyperground kits?

    I remember seeing a thread awhile back about the Hypergrounds, and that a member on here made them.
    Anyone remember who that is?

  2. #2
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    It's in the knowledge base under other mods iirc

  3. #3
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    I spend my time modding your lights and developing new products, not being your FaceBook friend.

    http://www.luxte.ch
    Lux Technologies

    Likes Hemissary liked this post

  4. #4
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    Complete unadulterated rip-off of unsuspecting folks hard-earned cash.
    2005 Magnum RT---Viper Venom Red----440ci Aluminum block----Short Runner Valve Intake--410mm BAER 6S Monoblock Extreme--Eibach Multi-Pro 2

    Custom--Grille Work--Hood--Headlights--Side View Mirrors--Rear Spoiler--Rear Diffuser--SRV Control System--Turbine Wheels

    Likes moparmike610, diboblo liked this post

  5. #5
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    What are they?


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  6. #6
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    never heard of that/them

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Z View Post
    never heard of that/them
    Quick google search looks like ground straps. Not sure if that’s what they are talking about tho haha


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  8. #8
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    thats what I thought until I clicked on the link

  9. #9
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    They - in non-technical terminology - are fat wires replacing skinny wires on the misnotion that somehow electricity flow has been increased. Its the old worn out adage "bigger is better"...like running 3" ID exhaust :^D

    The idea originated many years ago out of the ricer crowd where, similar to strut tower braces, someone conjured up the idea that they could claim the ground (B-) / positive (B+) leads were somehow inefficient / bad on their rides...and proceed to offer a snake oil solution. Some of the wild / dumbazz claims included(!) fatter ignition spark, fuel mileage increase, better starting, better throttle response, more HP / TQ...which are all bald-faced lies.

    The solution was to provide incredibly oversized awg B- leads that replaced the OEM units. What is ironic in our case is the positive (B+) leads and their connectivity were left untouched :^). Some of the bullsh!t included:
    - running a lead from somewhere(!) on the engine to the throttle body, even though the internal / redundant servo control system is isolated to ensure system integrity
    - big, fat, huge, oversized leads that - you guessed it - used normal terminations. This one was hilarious, as the peddlers clearly did not understand current flow and circular MIL area and could not get it through their thick skulls that nothing was improved at the point of termination (contact with all the mating / current-carrying interfaces). To put this into simple series-resistance analogy; imagine a 1/2" ID garden water hose and the tap is wide open. Imagine the water flow is current (electron) flow. Now place a hose clamp anywhere along that hose and start cranking it down to say 1/8" ID. Now do the same thing a huge 3" ID hose, or a 10" ID hose...and again reduce the flow with a hose clamp down to 1/8" ID. What the boneheads refused to acknowledge is that no diameter awg lead material is going to alter series resistance if the attachment points are the same as what was being replaced and(!) the conducting materials upstream or downstream are no different.

    What is series-resistance you ask; it is all the current conducting materials from a source (battery for example) to a load (starter for example). In this case it would include the +/- internal plates / exit post on the battery --> battery lead clamp --> battery lead --> battery lead termination --> vehicle chassis GND terminal --> vehicle chassis --> another vehicle chassis GNG terminal --> another GND lead with two terminations --> cylinder head termination --> aluminum(!) cylinder heads --> cylinder head attachment bolts --> engine block --> starter housing / attachment bolts --> starter terminal --> starter.

    This is just one GND-side path for current flow to start the vehicle. There are many others!

    Fact; the entire series-resistance is equal to, whichever material in that path exhibits the highest resistance. You could have 0awg lead material, but if it terminates in exactly the same manner and the OEM at the attachment points...nothing has changed. nada...zero :^)

    Here's some more information:
    - supposed improvements in series resistance was a sham really, as going from the OEM awg to the "new" thicker gauge awg over such short runs had practically zero impact on the existing rate of current flow
    - connecting GND leads in parallel results in what's called a ground loop, basically Omni-directional antennas that by-way of electro-magnetic interference (EMI) and / or radio frequency interference (RFI) added significant extraneous noise to the ground plane across the vehicle.

    This is what happens when those who do not understand electricity, peddle products to those who also do not understand electricity :^)
    Last edited by Hemissary; Today at 04:17 PM.

  10. #10
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    As Simon has described, electricity in terms of voltage and amperage flow differently.

    Voltage flows over a surface, while amperage flows through it. That distinction isn't well understood. Of course, electricity flows more readily over and through some metals better than others. Gold, for instance, is one of the best, and copper is better than aluminum. Anyway, voltage drops only matter over long distances...distances that are far longer than those that concern our cars.

    Just remember, that amperage is a bigger issue than voltage. Why? Let's take an example: coil packs. The coil packs in our cars are step-up transformers...they take low voltage and high amperage and convert it into high voltage and low amperage...that's what a hot spark requires. There are mathematical equations that are used to determine the amount of milliseconds it takes for each coil pack to recharge, given a required top end RPM. The OEM coil packs are a very good size for our cars.

    Now, most electrical issues with our cars occur with aftermarket equipment, like stereos, that, if installed poorly, work off existing wires that are sized for a factory-specific load, usually 10 amps or less. Good electrical installations use relays to manage power directly from a source, like a battery. The only time grounding becomes an issue is when the ground is insufficient for the load--that is, amperage, in which case, buss bars are a good choice as a point of termination.

    To make this long story short: The notion of the so-called hyperground is to create a quasi lightening rod--that is, to define a specific path to a ground. But if everything is OEM, and aftermarket stuff is limited, the use of a hyperground is totally unnecessary. Now, if the car has a big honking stereo that's pulls 1500 watts (100+ amps) by itself, then that's a totally different matter all together.

    Finally, Simon last point is instructive regarding electrical interference. If grounds aren't done properly an electrical harmonic is created. Any electrical motor has the potential to create an electrical harmonic, like radiator fans. Sometimes special filters are needed to strap around power cables to eliminate such interference.
    Last edited by richierevs; 06-11-2019 at 11:17 PM.

  11. #11
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    "Voltage flows over a surface, while amperage flows through it." Not a correct statement, although the point of your post is correct.



  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by done View Post
    "Voltage flows over a surface, while amperage flows through it." Not a correct statement, although the point of your post is correct.
    You are correct, I was being simplistic. Technically voltage is the charge of electrons from one end of a wire to another. Amperage on the other had is the speed of charge flow from one end of a wire to another. It takes a wire through a coil or ammeter to measure the flow of amperage under load or at work. Thus, it's possible to have a battery that registers 12 V, but contains or stores 0 amps. In batteries, it's voltage at a particular cold cranking amp that starts a motor.

    I have a voltmeter and a ammeter in my truck. My alternator is capable of supporting 250 amps at 12 volts while spinning at 2000 RPM. Support of 250 amps requires a fairly thick wire. Once the battery has been recharged (where the usage voltage from the alternator drops to 13.6 - 13.8 volts) the amp draw on the system has dropped to about 110 amps (as read on the ammeter) of steady draw. The amps will obviously increase with the flow demand or electrical work through the wire.
    Last edited by richierevs; 06-13-2019 at 09:37 PM.

  13. #13
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    Wonder how many forum visitors are capable of fully understanding our vehicles' electrical system. I have three electrical engineering degrees one specifically in power systems and I'm smart enough to know I don't get everything about car power systems.

    Stability of dc power systems depends on all the components including the cable characteristics. I imagine reducing the resistance/inductance of part of the system could cause undesired effects. The factory system is designed to be effective with enough margin to prevent costly warranty work.

    Those smaller gauge leads are part of complex circuits that are needed to provide filtering for so many electronic (switching) circuits. I bet cars have a dozen or more computers these days that rely on clean power and good front end filtering. Yes, the resistance and inductance of these leads comprises part of the system front end filters.

    Now if you are talking about a pre 1990s car, you probably can't hurt anything by beefing up all power leads. No computer and few if any switching electronics besides ignition.

    Adding big power amps or other big electrical loads should be done with caution. I could see Interactions between different switching loads causing instability in voltage regulation. Imagine the voltage regulator going unstable and creating large rapid voltage oscillations that could fry all your on board sensitive electronics. With the battery being 15' away from the alternator, there are bound to be many frequencies that would result in such a resonance.

  14. #14
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    While yes they are pretty useless...however I made a set for my G37. I put extra grounding in & saw an increase in the speed of shifting with the paddles. On a G37 there is a good lag from the paddles. Once I did this it was non existent.
    I never would pay for these though.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Rod Joe View Post
    Wonder how many forum visitors are capable of fully understanding our vehicles' electrical system. I have three electrical engineering degrees one specifically in power systems and I'm smart enough to know I don't get everything about car power systems.

    Stability of dc power systems depends on all the components including the cable characteristics. I imagine reducing the resistance/inductance of part of the system could cause undesired effects. The factory system is designed to be effective with enough margin to prevent costly warranty work.

    Those smaller gauge leads are part of complex circuits that are needed to provide filtering for so many electronic (switching) circuits. I bet cars have a dozen or more computers these days that rely on clean power and good front end filtering. Yes, the resistance and inductance of these leads comprises part of the system front end filters.

    Now if you are talking about a pre 1990s car, you probably can't hurt anything by beefing up all power leads. No computer and few if any switching electronics besides ignition.

    Adding big power amps or other big electrical loads should be done with caution. I could see Interactions between different switching loads causing instability in voltage regulation. Imagine the voltage regulator going unstable and creating large rapid voltage oscillations that could fry all your on board sensitive electronics. With the battery being 15' away from the alternator, there are bound to be many frequencies that would result in such a resonance.
    ?

    Replacing with any sized awg lead material results in zero changes to what is correctly termed inductance and or capacitance that would compromise any part of a / any vehicle's electrical system.

    As to adequate knowledge of the electrical principles and real-life application...this is why the miscreants got away with stealing from customers who bought into the bullsh!t. The peddlers themselves didn't have a clue; so the expectation even a tiny cross section of buyers is (and was) extremely unlikely. Its almost a perfect crime.
    Last edited by Hemissary; Today at 04:21 PM.

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