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Northern Rider
11-18-2011, 11:48 PM
My 2006 SRT8 is my choice as a daily driver so I needed something that I could soften up for the street then tighten up at the track.

I went with the newly released Eibach Multi Pro R2 Coilovers because I talked to their engineers (Eibach make systems for racers from NASCAR to Formula 1) and this is a brand new system with external resevoirs, and fully ajustable dampening and rebound.

I liked the fact that they did a lot of testing with the LX platform.



.http://mediacdn.shopatron.com/media/mfg/3269/product_image/c43122be3087862cc5c0febffa177730.jpg?1294116997


BTW - I got the system from an approved Eibach dealer online at theAmazonsite for $1100.00 less than the retail price.

I'm hoping to find other LX owners who have gone with this system to compare damping and rebound settings along with alignment specs.

At my last track outing, my lap times improved significantly, as did lateral G-Forces; better slip angle; turn in response; and stability out at the edge of adhesion.

Here are my alignment specs that Rob at Wretched Motorsports designed, knowing that I like to take my car onto the track:

Front Camber: -0.8 ; Front Caster: 9.6 ; Front Toe-in: 0.01; Steer-Ahead: 0.00

Rear Camber: -0.8 ; Rear Toe-in: 0.10; Thrust Angle: 0.06

RobAGD
11-19-2011, 01:39 AM
Pat I'll be honest that I have not seen anyone post about these.

Most of the guys here are running Kwv2's and BC and a few other variants.

The only guys I think running stuff like this would be the GT conti cars, only issue is those guys are running Challys vs the LX's.

Maybe check into the DTM ( euro sadan racing ).

-Robert

MAGFX
11-19-2011, 10:03 AM
Wow, I haven't seen those before. Very nice. I'm looking forward to hearing your (and other's) feedback.

What are you running, now?

I do see that they have the dual springs in the front, similar to the KW's. Back in the day when I was in the off-road world, we ran dual springs on some of the set-ups. Smart idea, I thought.

joelvan
11-19-2011, 11:31 AM
Ive been thinking about these because the Tein coilovers I have been using the springs have give up Im tring to decide whether to buy replacement springs for the Teins or find the money to buy the R2s which I really cannot afford.

Northern Rider
11-19-2011, 11:32 AM
Pat I'll be honest that I have not seen anyone post about these.

Most of the guys here are running Kwv2's and BC and a few other variants.

The only guys I think running stuff like this would be the GT conti cars, only issue is those guys are running Challys vs the LX's.

Maybe check into the DTM ( euro sadan racing ).

-Robert

Rob - Meister and I installed KW-2's in Phoenix just before the 07 spring fling. I broke a back shock at Fontana and eventually went back to the stock SRT8 setting.

Eibach just released this product this past summer. In the last vid I posted, I had the new Eibach Multi Pro R2's installed and you can see from my turn ins and corner exit speeds the clear advantage I had over the other cars on the track.

BTW - I paid just under $1800.00 for the system.


Wow, I haven't seen those before. Very nice. I'm looking forward to hearing your (and other's) feedback.

What are you running, now?

I do see that they have the dual springs in the front, similar to the KW's. Back in the day when I was in the off-road world, we ran dual springs on some of the set-ups. Smart idea, I thought.

MAGFX - I have this system installed now. The dual spring setup on the front makes a lot of sense, as the 2 compression rates gives you tuned variance over different loads.

Northern Rider
11-21-2011, 01:19 PM
< BUMP >

Gonna keep bumping this in the hopes others are going this route or at least thinking about it.

Just have to mention that on the 'soft settings' car is very drivable and comfortable on normal and rough roads - and still handles well.

On the track, I have only dialed in about 50% firmness damping - will continue to experiment once the warm weather comes back.

Got some pics of the the install as seen in the engine bay:


http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/data/500/medium/engine_bay.jpg (http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5350&size=big&cat=&ppuser=538)



Left Shock Resevoir with Rebound adjustment (Compression is the red knob on top of the shock tower)
http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/data/500/medium/LF_schock_fluid.jpg (http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5349&size=big&cat=&ppuser=538)

Right Shock Resevoir with Rebound adjustment (Compression is the red knob on top of the shock tower)

http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/data/500/medium/rt_shock_fluid.jpg (http://www.300cforums.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=5351&size=big&cat=&ppuser=538)

Northern Rider
11-26-2011, 11:44 PM
To the Top - once again . . .

inferno6.1
11-27-2011, 01:12 PM
Looks similar to the Fox external bypass coilovers I had on my '07 Tundra...I like the looks of those. How are they with ride height adjustability and how many settings are there for dampening/firmness?

Northern Rider
11-27-2011, 05:55 PM
Looks similar to the Fox external bypass coilovers I had on my '07 Tundra...I like the looks of those. How are they with ride height adjustability and how many settings are there for dampening/firmness?

Ride height ajustability seems similar to KW-2's. I'm guessing a range of around 2.5 inches, but will have to measure to get a precise number.

As to shock damping - compression (the big red knob on the resevoir) has 10 "click" settings and rebound (the small red knob on the top of the shock tower) has 6 "click" settings.

This winter, I am adding Eibach front and rear alignment kits to allow for greater range and easier adjustment, especially for camber settings.

It is my belief that with a chassis as rigid as the LX platform, we really do not have a big issue with chassis flex. The suspension design is fine. OEM bushings, though are very poor, wearing out rapidly with nomal driving. A bushing swap with a quality product, such as Pedders, has stabilized suspension movement. The addition of a Quaife LSD has given me smooth traction out of corners while under extreme lateral load.

The addition of the Eibach springs and adjustable shocks, coupled with grippy tires has given me a very predictable road circuit car with no nasty habits and smooth stability right out to the edge of adhesion (almost neutral handling at 1+ lateral G's.

My lap times have dropped by 4-5 seconds per lap (2:43 down to 2.38). This is significant, especially since the improvement came on a damp, cold track.

Hopefully, more tweaking will bring better results in the spring. Time for an electronic lap timer! :)

inferno6.1
11-27-2011, 07:17 PM
Ride height ajustability seems similar to KW-2's. I'm guessing a range of around 2.5 inches, but will have to measure to get a precise number.

As to shock damping - compression (the big red knob on the resevoir) has 10 "click" settings and rebound (the small red knob on the top of the shock tower) has 6 "click" settings.

This winter, I am adding Eibach front and rear alignment kits to allow for greater range and easier adjustment, especially for camber settings.

It is my belief that with a chassis as rigid as the LX platform, we really do not have a big issue with chassis flex. The suspension design is fine. OEM bushings, though are very poor, wearing out rapidly with nomal driving. A bushing swap this a quality product, such as Pedders, has stabilized suspension movement. The addition of a Quaife LSD has given me smooth traction out of corners while under extreme lateral load.

The addition of the Eibach springs and adjustable shocks, coupled with grippy tires has given me a very predictable road circuit car with no nasty habits and smooth stability right out to the edge of adhesion (almost neutral handling at 1+ lateral G's.

My lap times have dropped by 4-5 seconds per lap (2:43 down to 2.38). This is significant, especially since the improvement came on a damp, cold track.

Hopefully, more tweaking will bring better results in the spring. Time for an electronic lap timer! :)

Very nice...I think you made a good choice going with bypass style coilovers because from what I've read at least in the truck world is that they deal with heat that builds up over a long stint out offroad or on the track much better than standard coilovers...I guess as the heat builds up the fluids on the inside lose their viscosity and ability to efficiently dampen the car through the corners...Am I on the right track?:thumbs_u:

...no pun intended....

MAGFX
11-27-2011, 08:10 PM
Very nice...I think you made a good choice going with bypass style coilovers because from what I've read at least in the truck world is that they deal with heat that builds up over a long stint out offroad or on the track much better than standard coilovers...I guess as the heat builds up the fluids on the inside lose their viscosity and ability to efficiently dampen the car through the corners...Am I on the right track?:thumbs_u:

...no pun intended....David, I think that a bypass shock actually has small tubes, on the side of the main shock body. These allow the fluid to flow (bypass) through adjustable valves (usually with check, or one-way, valves) when the internal shock piston travels past the inlet or outlet of that particular bypass tube. These tubes are placed at specific points, which only affects a certain range, of the total shock travel.

I used to work in the off-road industry, and we built our own bypass shocks. We had three bypass tubes for compression and three for rebound. We used large needle valves to adjust the flow of each range. This is so we had three different compression and three different rebound settings depending on the position of the shock piston or more importantly, the position of the wheel through its travel. Actually, we had four different settings, per compression and rebound; three using the tubes and one that is preset in the shock piston, itself, outside of the bypassed areas.

Shock reservoirs are basically for added fluid, which you are correct, to help dissipate the heat. Quite often, these can be placed in ambient airflow for further cooling.

I hope this makes a little bit of sense. :blah:

Here is a typical bypass shock.
http://image.off-roadweb.com/f/36359361/1106or-08-+off-road-shocks-suspension-control-choices+bypass-shock.jpg

inferno6.1
11-27-2011, 08:25 PM
David, I think that a bypass shock actually has small tubes, on the side of the main shock body. These allow the fluid to flow (bypass) through adjustable valves (usually with check, or one-way, valves) when the internal shock piston travels past the inlet or outlet of that particular bypass tube. These tubes are placed at specific points, which only affects a certain range, of the total shock travel.

I used to work in the off-road industry, and we built our own bypass shocks. We had three bypass tubes for compression and three for rebound. We used large needle valves to adjust the flow of each range. This is so we had three different compression and three different rebound settings depending on the position of the shock piston or more importantly, the position of the wheel through its travel. Actually, we had four different settings, per compression and rebound; three using the tubes and one that is preset in the shock piston, itself, outside of the bypassed areas.

Shock reservoirs are basically for added fluid, which you are correct, to help dissipate the heat. Quite often, these can be placed in ambient airflow for further cooling.

I hope this makes a little bit of sense. :blah:

Here is a typical bypass shock.
http://image.off-roadweb.com/f/36359361/1106or-08-+off-road-shocks-suspension-control-choices+bypass-shock.jpg

Thanks for the explanation Jonn...King is as good as it gets too!:thumbs_u:

MattRobertson
11-27-2011, 08:59 PM
Wow. First I have seen of these, Pat. I'm still running my original V2's from back when dinosaurs ruled the Earth.

Where did you get that pricing deal? Or was it a secret bro deal? $1800 sounds reasonable. Full retail not so much.

joelvan
11-27-2011, 09:11 PM
I need someone to donate me a set for next season.:) I have some prime real estate on the car for whoever comes through :rock: I also need a Quaife

Northern Rider
11-27-2011, 09:54 PM
Wow. First I have seen of these, Pat. I'm still running my original V2's from back when dinosaurs ruled the Earth.

Where did you get that pricing deal? Or was it a secret bro deal? $1800 sounds reasonable. Full retail not so much.

Matt - these are a real, quality system - first class workmanship. that being said - Yeah the Eibach retail of over $2900 is a fairy tale. Tire Rack have them marked down to $2211.00. The price I found was on Amazon - from Amazon themselves not a 3rd party. I verified the status directly with Eibach themselves.

Here is what i paid from my online order form:


Items Ordered Price 1 of: Eibach 2895.713 Multi-Pro-R2 Coil-Over System (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0026VEWTQ/ref=ox_ya_os_product) [Automotive]
Condition: New
Sold by: Amazon.com LLC $1,811.44


This was back in September. I don't see that price there now.

MAGFX
11-27-2011, 10:49 PM
Here are some for $1963 with free shipping. (http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/details/QQDodgeQQChargerQQEibachQQCoil_Over_KitQQ2006QQE27 2873713.html)

netnathan
11-27-2011, 10:53 PM
That is a wicked looking setup.

..

Northern Rider
11-28-2011, 11:55 AM
Here are some for $1963 with free shipping. (http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/details/QQDodgeQQChargerQQEibachQQCoil_Over_KitQQ2006QQE27 2873713.html)

Good find!

MattRobertson
11-28-2011, 12:38 PM
Good find!
x2 that Jonn. Thx!

Not in the market now but I did see a spot of oil on the right rear before Darth went into the hospital. It hasn't persisted but sooner or later you gotta figure they have to go. This looks like the best alternative. the one big thing I have always pointed to with the V2's is their durability. I was just about the first guy to use a production set of these and I've put them thru a lot. they've never crapped out. That alone is enough to get me to buy them again unless you've got some durability under your belt that says different. When mine go you can bet I'll be asking for an update, Pat :-)

thx again for the info.!

MAGFX
11-28-2011, 01:00 PM
Matt, I just assumed that you bought those used KW V3's, with both compression and rebound adjustability, that were up here on the boards, earlier this year. These (Eibach) do look promising and yep, it is so cool that companies are still bringing out cool products.

Also, I love all of the information you guys come up with, that's geared towards road racing. :rock:

I want my ride to be an "everything" car, which definitely includes something with turns in it. Someday!:tinfoilhat:

NYC_SRT8
11-28-2011, 02:41 PM
Here are some for $1963 with free shipping. (http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/details/QQDodgeQQChargerQQEibachQQCoil_Over_KitQQ2006QQE27 2873713.html)

Nice find! If my bc racing set up every gives out I'll be getting something with seperate adjustments for rebound and compression. At the looks of things they are showing no signs of letting go though. They are a great coilover for the price. Plus replacement shocks are $40. You can go wrong with that.

ONE LOVE
11-29-2011, 11:06 AM
Great thread here.... I also am running the KWV2 set up..... I WANT THESE!!!! Are there any advantages by design over the KWV2? The reservoir looks nice and Im sure works great, but is there any more adjustability?? Looks like a killer set up, just need to find out if it is BETTER than the KW.... The price is even close to the KWV3 set>>>> Thanks...... Great info here

Northern Rider
11-29-2011, 12:47 PM
Great thread here.... I also am running the KWV2 set up..... I WANT THESE!!!! Are there any advantages by design over the KWV2? The reservoir looks nice and Im sure works great, but is there any more adjustability?? Looks like a killer set up, just need to find out if it is BETTER than the KW.... The price is even close to the KWV3 set>>>> Thanks...... Great info here

I have my old set of KW-2's sitting here in my garage, so here is my take on the differences:

KW-2 only have compression settings; the Eibach Multi Pro R2's also have rebound settings - a big advantage, if tuning for weight balance on each wheel as well as stability under extreme track loads. Seems to also help when you want softer settings for general daily driving.

Ride height range seems about the same and is adjusted in the same manner.

Both use dual springs on the front - great to prevent bottoming out under extreme track load ups - yet giving a "streetable" ride

The Eibach Multi Pro R2's have fluid reservoirs which really help cooling under track conditions.

From general appearance, the Eibach Multi Pro R2's seem to be made of better materials and seem to be more robust - but that is just a very subjective opinion on my part.

Having run both types on road circuits, i can tell you based on 2 lapping days under cold damp conditions, the Eibachs exceeded my expectations - low slip angles; high lateral g forces; stable under hard acceleration and braking; neutral handling - everything I want in a track car . . . (see vids in my sig)

NYC_SRT8
11-29-2011, 02:44 PM
Here are some for $1963 with free shipping. (http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/details/QQDodgeQQChargerQQEibachQQCoil_Over_KitQQ2006QQE27 2873713.html)

I found a discount code that takes another 10% off ( BML10 )

NYC_SRT8
11-29-2011, 02:45 PM
I have my old set of KW-2's sitting here in my garage, so here is my take on the differences:

KW-2 only have compression settings; the Eibach Multi Pro R2's also have rebound settings - a big advantage, if tuning for weight balance on each wheel as well as stability under extreme track loads. Seems to also help when you want softer settings for general daily driving.

Ride height range seems about the same and is adjusted in the same manner.

Both use dual springs on the front - great to prevent bottoming out under extreme track load ups - yet giving a "streetable" ride

The Eibach Multi Pro R2's have fluid reservoirs which really help cooling under track conditions.

From general appearance, the Eibach Multi Pro R2's seem to be made of better materials and seem to be more robust - but that is just a very subjective opinion on my part.

Having run both types on road circuits, i can tell you based on 2 lapping days under cold damp conditions, the Eibachs exceeded my expectations - low slip angles; high lateral g forces; stable under hard acceleration and braking; neutral handling - everything I want in a track car . . . (see vids in my sig)

What are your spring rates?

Northern Rider
11-30-2011, 10:45 AM
What are your spring rates?

Good question.

Because of the multiple spring front set up, the main spring is softer with the secondary spring harder. The secondary comes into play only after the main spring is fully compressed.

Eibach did extensive testing on the LX platform, according to the engineer I talked to, so I went with their bundled package - sort of a street / road track comprimise. I do not have the actual spring rate numbers.

You can specifiy different spring rates from Eibach - handy if you are setting up a track dedicated vehicle.

Here's some more info on this system from Eibach's site:




MULTI-PRO-R2 Coil-Over Kit
Double Adjustable Rebound and Compression Damping with Remote Reservoirs


THE ULTIMATE IN TUNABLE SUSPENSION PERFORMANCE

Easy Ride-Height/Corner Weight Adjustability
Monotube Design for Maximum Street and Track Performance
Spring Rates can be Tuned with a Wide Range of Eibach Motorsport ERS Springs (available separately)
Precise Spherical Upper Bushing Mount
Stainless-Steel/Teflon Braided Reservoir Lines
Legendary Eibach Suspension Quality and Tuning
100% Designed and Built at Eibach U.S.A
One—Year Warranty
For the ultimate in tunable suspension performance, Eibach has developed Multi-Pro coil-overs, specially tuned spring/damper units that allow you to extract the last ounce of cornering power from your late model performance car. The Coil-Over design lets you precisely tune the corner weights for optimum handling balance, and the wide range of the damping adjustability lets you tune for the comfort, ultimate grip, or anything in between. These suspension kits are perfect for the club racers or drivers who demand the high performance handling and optimal ride quality for which Eibach is famous.




MULTI-PRO-R2 CUT-A-WAY

http://performance-suspension.eibach.com/uploads/Image/performance-suspension.eibach.com/Street%20Performance/Coil-Over%20Suspension%20Systems/Multi-Pro-R2/MulProR2-Cut-a-way.jpg (http://performance-suspension.eibach.com/uploads/Image/performance-suspension.eibach.com/Street%20Performance/Coil-Over%20Suspension%20Systems/Multi-Pro-R2/MulProR2-Cut-a-way.jpg)
THE ULTIMATE IN TUNABLE SUSPENSION PERFORMANCE


10-Way Adjustable Compression Damping—Tunable for Street or Track
Adjustable Hard-Anodized Compression Piston
Hard Anodized Nitrogen End Cap with Dual Quad O-Ring for a Perfect Seal.
High Pressure Schrader Valve for Fine Tuning of Nitrogen Pressure
Stainless Tefl on Braided Hose for Maximum Strength and Damping Response
Free-Floating 46mm Hard-Anodized Gas Piston with Wear Band and Quad Ring for Exceptional Performance and Durability
7-Way Rebound Adjustable Aluminum Bypass Valve—Tunable for Street or Track
Ultra Light-Weight 2.5" Aluminum Top Hat
High-Strength .875" Nitro Steel Rod for Maximum Durability and Resistant to Extreme Side Loads
Monotube Design with our Exclusive 304 Stainless Seamless Tubing for Maximum Strength and Durabilty
2.5" I.D. Eibach Racing Springs (ERS) — Wide Range of Optional Spring Rates (sold separately) for Street or Track Tuning
Lightweight Locking Aluminum Adjustment Collars to Fine Tune Ride Height and Corner Weights
Large 46mm Hard Anodized Linear Design Piston for Improved Heat Dissipation and Reduced Fade
Bronze Impregnated Wear Band with O-ring backup for Maximum Performance, Durability and Reduced Stiction
Large .500" I.D. Shim Stack for Precise Response and Adjustability
7-Way Rebound Adjustable Aluminum Bypass Valve—Tunable for Street or Track

MikahB
11-30-2011, 11:50 AM
Good question.

Because of the multiple spring front set up, the main spring is softer with the secondary spring harder. The secondary comes into play only after the main spring is fully compressed.

Eibach did extensive testing on the LX platform, according to the engineer I talked to, so I went with their bundled package - sort of a street / road track comprimise. I do not have the actual spring rate numbers.

You can specifiy different spring rates from Eibach - handy if you are setting up a track dedicated vehicle....


From the pictures you've posted (I've not seen these in person), the second spring on the front shock appears to be what we would call a "helper spring." It really has nothing to do with spring rate or ride, it's there to keep the main spring engaged in the spring perch under high-droop conditions. If you look at the shocks with your car on the tires, the helper springs will be coil-bound.

The issue with these cars (and most stock vehicles) is that there is more wheel travel than what can be handled properly. To still have the main spring engaged at full droop, you'd have to have a really long (14" maybe?) main spring and that would limit you to a really soft rate to get it where you wanted at ride height.

Anyway - really nice looking setup and can't beat it for the price IMHO. For those running heavier duty front anti-roll bars, keep an eye on that front shock shaft. These cars are big and heavy and strapping a big anti-roll bar to the tabs on the shock body puts a ton of shear force on that shaft. The shocks on the GRAND-AM car have 22mm diameter shafts(!!!) to avoid any breakage. But, you could only buy one for this price! :mrgreen:

EDIT: Just saw in the last picture that the Eibach does have a pretty beefy front shock shaft, that is a good thing!

MattRobertson
11-30-2011, 11:52 AM
Yowzah. Thats worth more than a 'Like'. Green beans given.

Pat since you are the pioneer on this, can you take some more detailed shots of your underhood install for everyone's future reference next time its convenient?

So if you could do 'dedicated track' springs, would you? do you think its possible to tame a less forgiving set of springs with the compression and rebound settings or are we talking too much apples vs. oranges to play that game?

This really does look like the hot setup provided it survives over time.

Northern Rider
11-30-2011, 04:10 PM
From the pictures you've posted (I've not seen these in person), the second spring on the front shock appears to be what we would call a "helper spring." It really has nothing to do with spring rate or ride, it's there to keep the main spring engaged in the spring perch under high-droop conditions. If you look at the shocks with your car on the tires, the helper springs will be coil-bound.

The issue with these cars (and most stock vehicles) is that there is more wheel travel than what can be handled properly. To still have the main spring engaged at full droop, you'd have to have a really long (14" maybe?) main spring and that would limit you to a really soft rate to get it where you wanted at ride height.

Anyway - really nice looking setup and can't beat it for the price IMHO. For those running heavier duty front anti-roll bars, keep an eye on that front shock shaft. These cars are big and heavy and strapping a big anti-roll bar to the tabs on the shock body puts a ton of shear force on that shaft. The shocks on the GRAND-AM car have 22mm diameter shafts(!!!) to avoid any breakage. But, you could only buy one for this price! :mrgreen:

EDIT: Just saw in the last picture that the Eibach does have a pretty beefy front shock shaft, that is a good thing!

Thanks, Mikah for clarifying the dual spring relationship for this ancient, technically challenged road course warrior. :)

BTW - I really like that Grand-Am car you guys are developing!

Way back in the early 70's I was forunate enough to pick up a ride with a privateer Trans-Am team in their Corvette for a couple of races. Back then, horsepower was king - but aerodynamic engineering was rudimentary, as I found out, when, in practice - the nose of the Vette decided to point to the heavens as I barrelled down the backside of Pocono. A scary moment!!! :panic:



Yowzah. Thats worth more than a 'Like'. Green beans given.

Pat since you are the pioneer on this, can you take some more detailed shots of your underhood install for everyone's future reference next time its convenient?

So if you could do 'dedicated track' springs, would you? do you think its possible to tame a less forgiving set of springs with the compression and rebound settings or are we talking too much apples vs. oranges to play that game?

This really does look like the hot setup provided it survives over time.

Thanks Matt. I will try and get some more shots before I tuck her away for the winter (she's never had to suffer this indignation before - always slugged through our snow and ice). The rear reservoirs are buried under the car - but we'll move those into the trunk before she rolls out again to a track in the spring.

As to a dedicated track set up - no, not with this car. I want to keep it as a daily driver (taking the GC to Mexico and hopefully to SoCal for the Spring Festival).

I guess my kick - these days - is taking an almost stock SRT8 to lapping sessions and running up against other similar "street" cars - especially Stangs; Audis; BMW's and Porsches . . .

MAGFX
11-30-2011, 04:42 PM
From the pictures you've posted (I've not seen these in person), the second spring on the front shock appears to be what we would call a "helper spring." It really has nothing to do with spring rate or ride, it's there to keep the main spring engaged in the spring perch under high-droop conditions. If you look at the shocks with your car on the tires, the helper springs will be coil-bound.

The issue with these cars (and most stock vehicles) is that there is more wheel travel than what can be handled properly. To still have the main spring engaged at full droop, you'd have to have a really long (14" maybe?) main spring and that would limit you to a really soft rate to get it where you wanted at ride height.

Anyway - really nice looking setup and can't beat it for the price IMHO. For those running heavier duty front anti-roll bars, keep an eye on that front shock shaft. These cars are big and heavy and strapping a big anti-roll bar to the tabs on the shock body puts a ton of shear force on that shaft. The shocks on the GRAND-AM car have 22mm diameter shafts(!!!) to avoid any breakage. But, you could only buy one for this price! :mrgreen:

EDIT: Just saw in the last picture that the Eibach does have a pretty beefy front shock shaft, that is a good thing!


Thanks, Mikah for clarifying the dual spring relationship for this ancient, technically challenged road course warrior. :)

BTW - I really like that Grand-Am car you guys are developing!

Way back in the early 70's I was forunate enough to pick up a ride with a privateer Trans-Am team in their Corvette for a couple of races. Back then, horsepower was king - but aerodynamic engineering was rudimentary, as I found out, when, in practice - the nose of the Vette decided to point to the heavens as I barrelled down the backside of Pocono. A scary moment!!! :panic:




Thanks Matt. I will try and get some more shots before I tuck her away for the winter (she's never had to suffer this indignation before - always slugged through our snow and ice). The rear reservoirs are buried under the car - but we'll move those into the trunk before she rolls out again to a track in the spring.

As to a dedicated track set up - no, not with this car. I want to keep it as a daily driver (taking the GC to Mexico and hopefully to SoCal for the Spring Festival).

I guess my kick - these days - is taking an almost stock SRT8 to lapping sessions and running up against other similar "street" cars - especially Stangs; Audis; BMW's and Porsches . . .

X2 on the dual springs clarification. I would have bet a dollar that they were an added support spring (at least on my KW's, which are much beefier than the Eibach ones), but I just checked and yep, they are coil bound. I would have lost my dollar. LOL Learn something every day.:thumbs_u:

When I was working in the off road racing industry, we did use two stacked springs, with different spring rates and one was much less than the other). I am going to have to research that, as I thought they were both support springs to create a progressive set-up.

MikahB
11-30-2011, 05:12 PM
X2 on the dual springs clarification. I would have bet a dollar that they were an added support spring (at least on my KW's, which are much beefier than the Eibach ones), but I just checked and yep, they are coil bound. I would have lost my dollar. LOL Learn something every day.:thumbs_u:

When I was working in the off road racing industry, we did use two stacked springs, with different spring rates and one was much less than the other). I am going to have to research that, as I thought they were both support springs to create a progressive set-up.

You've got it right for offroad. In the offroad world where wheel travel is all-important, you have to manage the wheel throughout the whole range of motion - sometimes up to 20" vertically (!!!). You want a nice compliant spring to let the wheels work over terrain without disturbing the chassis, but you need something stiff so when your soft spring coilbinds on landing or heavy impact, you don't knock out all your teeth and end up having a bad day! :mrgreen:

With road racing where surfaces are smooth and grip levels much higher, we work harder to minimize the motion of the tires relative to the body so we can control the contact patches and keep the tires in their happy place.


Thanks, Mikah for clarifying the dual spring relationship for this ancient, technically challenged road course warrior. :)

BTW - I really like that Grand-Am car you guys are developing!

Way back in the early 70's I was forunate enough to pick up a ride with a privateer Trans-Am team in their Corvette for a couple of races. Back then, horsepower was king - but aerodynamic engineering was rudimentary, as I found out, when, in practice - the nose of the Vette decided to point to the heavens as I barrelled down the backside of Pocono. A scary moment!!! :panic:

Glad I could contribute! TRANS-AM cars are STILL scary, but I've not seen one take flight! Atlantic Autosport (race team) raced a TRANS-AM Vette before we built the Challenger - it was quite the little hotrod... When it was running. :)

For you road race fans, here's one of my favorite videos - Mike Skeen in our Corvette driving from last to 2nd at Road Atlanta in 2009. Truly poetry in motion with a great soundtrack to boot!

Mike Skeen: 2009 SCCA Trans-Am at Road Atlanta - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0uf7vIb6qQ)

Northern Rider
11-30-2011, 05:27 PM
Thanks for the great ride along vid!

My fingers and toes were a-twitchin' the entire time . . . :racing:

RobAGD
11-30-2011, 06:51 PM
i kinda prefer this Mike Skeen video :ninja:

pnVlL5MctoY

MikahB
11-30-2011, 07:35 PM
That is a great video, Rob. I hated that car had teething issues and was never able to show what it was really made of - what a beast!

RobAGD
11-30-2011, 07:40 PM
Nothing like taking an Nationwide Car, stuff an ARCA engine and Daytona Prototype brakes on it and run everything down :) I would love to see that thing in a race.

I still need to send my KW's back in for servicing, they are not happy.

-R

Northern Rider
01-28-2012, 11:12 PM
Time for another . . . .:bump:

joelvan
03-08-2012, 10:21 PM
My R2s are built and should get them next week. That good deal you got on Amazon wasn't there anymore I ended up paying a little over 2k for mine shipped. I will be listing my Tein super streets shortly $750

netnathan
03-08-2012, 10:52 PM
My R2s are built and should get them next week. That good deal you got on Amazon wasn't there anymore I ended up paying a little over 2k for mine shipped. I will be listing my Tein super streets shortly $750

Where did you find Tein Super Streets for $750?

..


Sent from NS1iPad using Tapatalk

joelvan
03-08-2012, 11:06 PM
Where did you find Tein Super Streets for $750?

..


Sent from NS1iPad using Tapatalk

I paid around $1500. for the Tein's 2 years and 10k miles ago

netnathan
03-09-2012, 12:22 AM
I paid around $1500. for the Tein's 2 years and 10k miles ago

Duh.....oh...you are selling your Tein's for $750.
I thought you were just stating you are going to the Eibach from Tein's that only cost you $750.

How did you like the Tein's?

..

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk

joelvan
03-10-2012, 09:43 PM
I liked the Teins fine I need the adjustable compression and rebound that the R2s have Plus the stiffer springs. the R2s are more of a compitition spring and that is what I need.

Northern Rider
08-05-2012, 11:59 AM
This is the best article I have found for tuning adjustable shocks for Bump (Damping) and Rebound:

KONI shock tuning guide (http://www.bimmerhaus.com/tech/shocktuningTN.html)

I will be tuning this week and will publish my settings that I settle on for the Eibach Multi Pro R2's, when I am finished.

joelvan
10-05-2012, 06:59 PM
I have found a real problem with the R2s for my application. the springs are too soft. and the shock bodies need to be about 2 inches shorter. for the suspension travel I need . In my race series there is a Minimum ride height 3.5 inches at the rocker panels using the requires 18' tires and I need to be as close as possible to that to have the lowest center of gravity. at that height I only have 1/2 travel in the front before the shock bottoms out and 2 inches in the rear. right now the car handles fairly neutral it is still too soft I got the compression and rebound tightened all the way but when it bottoms out it causes premature tire wear actual damage to the tire and lap times fall off during the race. I would like to be able to go up in spring rates the same percentage front and rear to keep the car neutral . But I allready have the stiffest rear spring that Eibach makes . customer support wasn't much help. I am really aggravated at my situation

Tikibeast
06-07-2014, 12:13 AM
:bump:

Any updates?

never-enough
09-13-2014, 11:33 PM
Anyone else have anything to add?
im considering the multi pro r2s for my challenger.
It's not my daily driver, and although I don't track the car, i do use it for spirited canyon driving pretty often.
If not this system, what else is recommended for our platform if I'm looking to lower a little but mainly upgrade the handling?
thanks.

Hemissary
09-14-2014, 12:12 AM
They are fabulous, worth every penny...

never-enough
09-15-2014, 05:01 PM
That's what I was hoping to hear, as I haven't found any other kits that seem to compare.
Many other parts to recommend swapping when the coilovers go on?
I'm considering adding subframe connectors as well.

Hemissary
09-15-2014, 05:28 PM
The addition of other performance-enhancing suspension parts depends on what you're going to use the vehicle for, and to a lesser degree what your torque O/P is. Note that the R2's are really overkill for the street.

One thing others who elect to install this system might like; the front reservoirs fit beautifully under the front access covers of a Magnum. The horns need to be relocated, and one of the tabs on the covers needed to be cut off flush. The receiving holes now support the billet reservoir clamps other than this there was no drilling or any other mods required. In fact - they were easily thread up through the frame and past the headlights;

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Moebius44/P1020178_zps514691f7.jpg

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Moebius44/P1020180_zps48b408ce.jpg

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z142/Moebius44/P1020181_zps3c1fb083.jpg

ZiggyZaggy
09-15-2014, 09:11 PM
What's the cost of these "Bad Bois" on the open market?

Hemissary
09-15-2014, 09:23 PM
Not cheap; check Discount Tire, got a pretty good deal...

Northern Rider
09-16-2014, 05:24 PM
Nice setup on the reservoirs, Simon.