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  1. #1
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    5.7 Cam Swap Help

    I have a 2005 300C 5.7 RWD and I’m swapping in a greene racing cam. I’m also swapping lifters, springs and rods. My question: what all is nevessary for the swap as far as gaskets, bolts, timing set, and anything else i’m missing? The total amount of this is getting insane!

    thanks

  2. #2
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    I've done cams on my two 5.7's and am currently in the middle of doing the same to my 300 C 6.1. I think I might be able to help you a bit and maybe give you some hints and suggestions, recommendations.

    First, since yours in an 05, I'd highly recommend that while the heads are off, get all the valve seats replaced. I did this proactively on both my 5.7's to pretty much eliminate the possibility of dropping a valve seat. Ask me for further info. on this, if you're interested. While I had them apart I thought, why not finish the job and do it right. I had all the heads ported and polished and had .030 in. milled off them to increase the compression ratio by about a half point to about 10.3:1. This improved the compression pressures from the "before" pressures by 20-25 PSI. As a side note, I did the MDS friendly cams (FRI Sidewinders) on both my 5.7's several years ago WITHOUT removing the heads. I changed all the valve springs on both to 6.1 exhaust valve springs and used 6.1 pushrods and timing chain tensioners. I also advanced the cam in my Hemi Jeep by 6* and the one on my Hemi LX by 10*. This slightly moved the power/torque curve to a lower RPM. I did the seats/head work last year.

    Now to yours and, yes it can get expensive, depending on whether or not you want to do it complete and right so you won't have to mess with it for a long time. First what are the specs. (primarily lift, duration, lobe separation angle) of the cam you're going to install? Is it an "MDS friendly" cam? How many miles are on the engine? What kind of lifters are you using? Do you have headers/cat. back on it? If so, what kind? What kind of horsepower gains are you expecting? Is the transmission stock? Do you still have the stock 2.82:1 "peg leg" differential in it? Do you have a tuner(s)? If so, what kind(s)?

    As far as gaskets go, you'll need a cylinder head gasket kit, a front cover gasket with crank pulley seal, a 6.1 chain tensioner (optional), two sets of head bolts (DO NOT reuse the originals), the two o-rings for the heater lines going into the timing cover, some RTV sealant, and a good torque wrench (be sure to follow all FSM torquing procedures). Other things I would recommend you do while its apart and if needed are any/all of the things that are a PITA when the engine is together in the vehicle......the water pump, the MAP Sensor, the front O2 Sensors, motor mounts, both radiator hoses, and all heater hoses. Also, consider getting a new PCV Valve and a cooler thermostat (I use 190*). So you don't end up with a complete mess on the floor, you'll need to completely drain the cooling system......radiator and both sides of the engine block. It also helps to have a mid-length set of 1/4 in. sockets for removing the valve cover bolts...especially the lower rear on the passenger side. Unless you have a zillion miles on yours, you shouldn't need a timing set. My Jeep had about 90K on it when I did the cam and the timing set still looked like new. A few other things you'll need are, engine/cam assembly lube, 2 gallons of Hybrid Organic Acid Technology (HOAT) concentrate anti-freeze (I use only the Mopar stuff), 2 gallons of distilled water, 7 quarts of 5W-20 synthetic oil, especially if you're retaining the MDS, a high quality oil filter, and new copper core spark plugs. I opted to do all of the stuff above, as I didn't want to mess with any of it again (except spark plugs) for at least 50-60K miles.

    Hope this helps as this should get you started going in the right direction.
    Last edited by magnuman; 03-08-2019 at 10:49 PM.
    06 300CSRT8, stock, 06 Jeep GCO and 05 Magnum RT both modded almost the same, MDS "ON" Lt, Fumoto Drain Valves, BT Catch Cans, SRT8 CAIs, AFE Filters, Sonnax Trans Line Press Booster, SC, DS and HP Tuners, Transgo Shift Kit, ARH Long Tube Hdrs w/3 in Magnaflow/Xlerator AP Exh Sys, Bilsteins, SRT Springs/Sways, Cust Eng Cvrs, SRT8 frt/rear bumpers, FRI Sidewinder Cams advanced (Jeep 6*/Maggie 10*), 6.1 valvetrain, SLP 25% UD Pulley, BBK and Arrington 90mm T-Bodies, SOS Ign Coils,TEA ported/milled heads w/new valve seats, SRT Reps.
    Thanks 2005rtmag thanked for this post

  3. #3
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    Ok, thanks for the detailed reply. My car will have a Jay Greene custom grind: 209/216, 0.549/0.544 and 109 LSA. I already have these thing or have ordered them: Head gaskets, intake manifold gaskets, valve cover gaskets, timing cover gasket, water pump gasket, head bolts, assembly lube, valve seals, 6.1 pushrods, new lifters, 6.1 springs, a new timing chain and a 180* thermostat. I also have JBA long tubes I'm waiting to put on for when I do this. This is my daily driver too, so I wanna sort of get a timeframe if I could. Is this something I could work on for 2-3 days all day and get done? Also, is any of the stuff I named not necessary? I don't plan on bulletproffing the car and would like to keep it budget-friendly, so not really looking to get the heads ported or anything. As far as the valve seat issue, I have heard a lot about it, but I can't afford to leave the heads with a shop, as it's my daily driver and I wouldn't have another car to get to work. I have a diablosport intune and will be getting a custom tune from jay to accommodate his cam. He told me the cam and tune would be 40-50 whp gain from stock. My car is at 123k miles. The lifters are non-mds, which I already have it turned off in the tune, so I can just leave the stock solenoids in and unplug them I think, it should serve the same purpose as the plugs. Let me know what stuff is absolutely necessary (other than what I have already) and if I'm missing anything!

    Thanks

  4. #4
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    If you have all the stuff in my Post No. 2, you should be alright. Your cam has some pretty good specs. and should be real strong, especially on the bottom end. 40-50 hp. gains with the headers is probably about right. You may have to raise the idle speed a bit too. I'd recommend you get the two o-rings for the heater tubes that go into the front cover, as you will not know their condition until you take it apart. The 2 cost only $5-6 from the dealer the last time I bought them. Along with the assembly lube, I also use Comp. Cams Valve Train Assembly Lube (p/n 106) which is primarily for the initial start. I'd also recommend you pick up an SRT timing chain tensioner, especially if you're going to have a higher rev. limit and shift points....which you will. Also, if you're like me, you won't be able to keep your foot out of it for a long time, if ever. It'll be a bunch of fun for sure.

    On the MDS Solenoids, I'd just leave them alone and plugged in. You've turned the MDS off with the tuner so you won't have any problems.

    If you have a good, well lit work area and all the needed tools/pullers, etc. and a good mechanical ability, you can probably do the cam on a long weekend....if you're totally unfamiliar with the engine, it'll take longer.....learning curve. Doing the headers at the same time will most certainly add time. If you don't have a hoist of some sort (I have a drive on hoist that raises the car about 3 ft. off the ground), you'll have a little more difficulty, as you'll have to be both underneath and in the engine compartment when working on the vehicle. If you just have jack stands and a floor jack, you'll need something to stand on when you're working on top. Otherwise you'll have to jack it up, lower it, jack it up....just an annoying inconvenience and additional time consumer.

    Now to the headers. I am assuming you also have the mids., otherwise you're going to have hook up problems. Are the headers set up for the EGR Valve? If not, and you live in an area where the "smog nazis" check your vehicle, you're going to have a problem, with both the cats. and the EGR Valve. For header fasteners, I'd highly recommend you use a good flange head bolt (17 each), 8mm-1.25X25mm (or slightly longer) and use Nord-Lock Wedge Washers. This way they'll never, ever come loose unless you loosen them (Nord-Lock Wedge-Locking Washers - Junker Vibration Test - YouTube) I also use Percy's Seal-4-Good dead soft aluminum gaskets, P/N 66040. This part number works for both 5.7/6.1's. If you want just the 5.7 ones (I've never used them) the part number is, 66075.

    Here's a few random things that just came to mind.....no particular order. Be sure to torque everything to the FSM specs. using the outlined procedures. You'll need both an inch lb. and a ft. lb. torque wrench to do it right. Also, be sure to get the cam timing lined up properly. If you don't have one, you'll need a fuel line removal tool, and be sure to dump fuel pressure before you remove the fuel line at the injector rail. Otherwise you may get a face full of fuel. I pull the fuel pump fuse and try to start the engine to bleed the pressure off. Then remove the battery cables. When done with the whole job, change the oil/filter. You can pull the heads with the stock exhaust logs in place...just disconnect where the mids. hook to them. You can place your long tubes about where they're going to sit for the connection to the heads. You'll need to remove the stock mids. first though. Getting all the bolts started and tightened is a time consumer. I've found that, once started, an offset ratcheting open end/box wrench works the best for tightening most of the hard to get to ones. On the first start, do not rev. the engine, just let it idle for 5-10 minutes so everything gets oiled real well. It'll clatter like crazy at first too, until the lifters pump up. Speaking of lifters, soak them in engine assembly lube for a while before installing them.

    This should get you going and if I think of anything else, I'll let you know.
    Last edited by magnuman; 03-12-2019 at 09:42 PM.

  5. #5
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    With a Chrysler 300 it is to easy to just take the complete front bumper cover off the car. Jack the car up and get it on stands. Get the front bumper cover off. Remove the radiator and drop the lower support. Pull one of the lines off the power steering cooler and plug them up. This opens up the whole front of the engine and is worth the extra hour of work. When I did my swap last fall it took me 23 hours. This was just me myself working on it. This included ported heads, custom cam, lifters, 6.1 oil pump, tensioner/chain, SRT shorties and intake manifold.I had not been that far into a Hemi engine that far before. But I researched for almost a year and read everything online I could find. Make sure you have every tool you need. I printed out and laminated the torque sequence for the heads. Also get large notebook and mark which length bolts go where for the water pump/front cover and get a box of zip lock bags and a marker and bag and tag all of the hardware as you take things aparts. It will make things so much easier going back together. Frankly the worse part of the whole job is getting the valve covers off the engine. I assume you know the trick to get the rear lower passenger side valve cover bolt off correct?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4DoorMuscle View Post
    With a Chrysler 300 it is to easy to just take the complete front bumper cover off the car. Jack the car up and get it on stands. Get the front bumper cover off. Remove the radiator and drop the lower support. Pull one of the lines off the power steering cooler and plug them up. This opens up the whole front of the engine and is worth the extra hour of work. When I did my swap last fall it took me 23 hours. This was just me myself working on it. This included ported heads, custom cam, lifters, 6.1 oil pump, tensioner/chain, SRT shorties and intake manifold.I had not been that far into a Hemi engine that far before. But I researched for almost a year and read everything online I could find. Make sure you have every tool you need. I printed out and laminated the torque sequence for the heads. Also get large notebook and mark which length bolts go where for the water pump/front cover and get a box of zip lock bags and a marker and bag and tag all of the hardware as you take things aparts. It will make things so much easier going back together. Frankly the worse part of the whole job is getting the valve covers off the engine. I assume you know the trick to get the rear lower passenger side valve cover
    bolt off correct?
    Good advice and excellent procedure. I just pulled the front end off my 300CSRT this afternoon (a PITA because of the headlight washer hoses hard to remove) and will try to get to the cam tomorrow or Thursday, time permitting. For both of my 5.7's, I did the same as you, lots and lots of research. I copied and hi-lited the important stuff from the FSM (and the cam change info. on this forum) and used it religiously. I just pulled the stack of papers out again today in preparation for the cam swap in the 6.1. You sure can't remember everything, even if you're on your third change like I am. I use cupcake/muffin pans for most of the smaller parts, and some of the bigger ones I do like you and use quart or gallon zip lock bags.

  7. #7
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    Every chance I get, I do some research on the swap, different parts, procedures, etc. I actually won't have any cats, and was sort of looking into an EGR delete. For anyone that's done it, is it worth it? I'll have the longtubes clamped with a gasket onto a fabbed midpipe and straight out the back (Nice and loud haha), since i don't live where it matters. I will still have the 02 sensors though, and make sure to get the AFR's set correctly through the tune. I will probably go that route of taking the whole front end off, seems easier than breaking my back and using a jack (Even though I'll still have to use it for the headers). But overall, I plan to get this done on a weekend, and I will most likely pull an all-nighter the first day to see how far I can get to get ahead, and then just sleep a little and go at it before work on Monday. I know this is a tight time frame, that's why I'm gathering as much info as I can to make it as quick and painless as I can. I plan on doing everything and just running the oil for a few hundred or so miles to get all the lube and stuff circulated and then change it to some fresh oil. Not to sound dumb here, but would it be bad to just tighten the heads down until they're as tight as I can get them?

    Also a side note, am I able to re-use the stock 5.7 spring retainers with the 6.1 springs?

    Thanks for all the input
    Last edited by Mandrow7; 03-13-2019 at 01:03 AM.

  8. #8
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    not torquing the head is not a good idea!

    2007 BB Charger SRT8
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  9. #9
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    when you remove the water pump, make a drawing of one on a pc of cardboard, then push the bolts through the cardboard in the location you took them out. There are bunch of different length bolts in there. I have a 6.1, so I'm not familiar with the 5.7. I was able to bolt my Kooks longtubes to the heads before I installed them, it made the job really easy. Like stated above, print out all the info you are going to need as you don't want to be washing up to use a computer every 14 minutes. I think you could get everything wrapped up in a good weekend provided nothing unexpected pops up. My brother dropped a pencil into a spark plug hole!? That was a solid 3 hrs to get fish out. Don't do that. Good luck, have fun.

    bill

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandrow7 View Post
    Every chance I get, I do some research on the swap, different parts, procedures, etc. I actually won't have any cats, and was sort of looking into an EGR delete. For anyone that's done it, is it worth it? I'll have the longtubes clamped with a gasket onto a fabbed midpipe and straight out the back (Nice and loud haha), since i don't live where it matters. I will still have the 02 sensors though, and make sure to get the AFR's set correctly through the tune. I will probably go that route of taking the whole front end off, seems easier than breaking my back and using a jack (Even though I'll still have to use it for the headers). But overall, I plan to get this done on a weekend, and I will most likely pull an all-nighter the first day to see how far I can get to get ahead, and then just sleep a little and go at it before work on Monday. I know this is a tight time frame, that's why I'm gathering as much info as I can to make it as quick and painless as I can. I plan on doing everything and just running the oil for a few hundred or so miles to get all the lube and stuff circulated and then change it to some fresh oil. Not to sound dumb here, but would it be bad to just tighten the heads down until they're as tight as I can get them?

    Also a side note, am I able to re-use the stock 5.7 spring retainers with the 6.1 springs?

    Thanks for all the input
    The EGR is actually about the only useful emission device, IMO. It lowers the combustion temperatures and helps prevent pre-ignition. If the headers you're using DOES NOT have the EGR tube from the No. 2 cylinder primary tube to the EGR port on the header flange, you'll either have to have it added or you'll end up going without. Some folks grind a notch in the header flange from the No. 2 port to the EGR port. This works too, but you have to be sure the notch is big enough (~1/4 in. wide and 3/16 in. deep, also cut the gasket away there too) to give adequate flow to the EGR Valve or you'll still get a MIL. Going without causes a continuous Malfunction Indicator Light (MIL), unless you can get someone to turn it off. The early Diablosport Tuners allowed you to do it, but the Feds' got after them and they had to take it out. Most custom tuner folks won't do it either for fear of being fined by the Feds. for messing with the emissions systems. If you can get your tuner guy to do it, go for it, otherwise I'd have the tube welded in and keep it. As I said, the EGR does more good than harm.

    It's a BAD idea to NOT change your oil immediately after doing this. I'll guarantee that you'll get anti-freeze and who knows what else falling into the pan. It's also the MOST TERRIBILE idea to not torque your heads.....just tighten as tight as you can. You're for sure just asking for a "redo" and probably more by doing something like this. All I can say is, good luck if you start taking short cuts.

    Yes, you can use the stock spring retainers with the 6.1 valve springs.

    Quote Originally Posted by funkpolice View Post
    when you remove the water pump, make a drawing of one on a pc of cardboard, then push the bolts through the cardboard in the location you took them out. There are bunch of different length bolts in there. I have a 6.1, so I'm not familiar with the 5.7. I was able to bolt my Kooks longtubes to the heads before I installed them, it made the job really easy. Like stated above, print out all the info you are going to need as you don't want to be washing up to use a computer evaery 14 minutes. I think you could get everything wrapped up in a good weekend provided nothing unexpected pops up. My brother dropped a pencil into a spark plug hole!? That was a solid 3 hrs to get fish out. Don't do that. Good luck, have fun.

    bill
    I'll be pulling the front cover on my 6.1 today or tomorrow and using the cardboard for the bolts is exactly what I've done every time....for the exact reason stated by, funkpolice. FYI, Bill, the 5.7's and 6.1's are exactly the same in the front of the engine....most everything for that matter, except pulling the front bumper. The SRT is a real PITA, mostly because of the headlight washers. For me, it was a real bear to get the hoses off the washer nozzles (or anywhere else) because they were put on there to never come off. I didn't want to damage anything so I drained the washer reservoir and pulled the headlight washer pump and took the whole mess off together. IMO, more work than it was worth, but it worked.

    Good to know you could bolt the long tubes to the heads and then install the whole mess together. That had to save 2 or more hours, depending on how easy it would have been to start the bolts with the heads on. I've never tried it on an LX. No way could I do it on my 5.7 Hemi Jeep though. I recently installed long tubes on it and it was easily the most difficult job I've ever done on it. Engine work was always cake (a little tighter and narrower frame rails than the LX's though) but, I'll never do headers on a WK again....for sure.
    Last edited by magnuman; 03-13-2019 at 11:44 AM.

  11. #11
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    Do NOT skip the proper head torquing procedure! Things will end very badly if you do. Not to mention it's not just a matter of torquing them as tight as you can get them. I could have easily tightened mine past the proper torque value. Just FYI you also do not reuse the head bolts or the main crank bolt.



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