Those hell-bent on a lower T-stat should read this

[Guest]

I know for a fact that the SRT Engineers have stated on record to owners that you should never swap out for a lower thermostat.

Someone at the SoCal M&G (could possibly have been Ralph Gilles himself) also said the same thing about ALL LX's, not limited to SRT's.

Here is another post confirming this, AND a technical explanaition as to why: Click the link thingy

I'm not telling anyone what to do, simply empowering them with the factual information neccessary to form a concienscous decision.

[Rev.Hammer]

This is all new information to me from a local Mopar Performance Shop that is building a 6.4 Hemi stroker engine. First, tight bearing oil clearances, hence-the 0W-40 oil, secondly, this engine has very short length aluminum pistons (skirt to piston top), hence the 203*thermostat:thirdly, the top piston ring end gap is only .007 and the extra heat expands the rings for a better seal, lastly, a MDS system isn't possible because of the cam profile and lobe centerline design. I'm not convinced that a cooler temp thermostat is needed as the stock PCM looks at this temp in the performance mode and because of the stock design of this engine. Now when the parameters of the PCM are modified, all the other changes would add to the performance. DCX has at least two modified PCMs but they aren't being released. Why? Maybe the Warranty Factor? Hacking into the brains of any new PCMs is much more difficult now than older designs. However this can be done. I'm not convinced yet on all the jumping into performance modifications until they are tested fully. All this information was made available to me at the track last Sat. 4/8. The way this engine pulls stock there is a lot of performance not tapped into. Also some of the Performance Tuners on the 5.7 Hemi have had some software problems and aren't perfected totally yet. So be patient and let the Vendors experiment first. MHO Gene

Courtesy of SRT8JEEP of SRT8oc .com


Has anyone here reported or seen any effects of blow-by?

[Zog]

I hear a can of worms opening!

[Rev.Hammer]

No worms from me, all I care about is veracity!

[HotRodK]

I like V E L O C I T Y myself.

[mikeyb]

I bet they are running the 200 degree thermostat for emission reasons.


MikeyB

[Guest]

No, the reasons are stated in that article.

[MAGNUM8R]

C'mon and Stir it Up!!!

[boggart]

I don't think the SRT guys would tell you not to change thermostats if they were only running them for emissions. They only have to pass emissions tests before they sell it, if it would run better with a lower t-stat, safely, they would be all over telling you to put a lower t-stat in it.

Seems pretty clear to me... Change the stat if you want to change the engine later on and then change the stat back when you pay for the new engine so you don't have to keep doing that.

[mikeyb]

I have a hard time believing 20 degrees makes that big of a difference in the metallurgy.

MikeyB

[createdbyone]

i hate when we argue over these things. Thank god we dont have an LX race car...we couldnt even agree what octane to put in it lol . I think we should just all kinda do what we want to do. I personelly run a 180 thermo, wont tell anyone else without warning becuase we really dont know if it is good or not. I think experimentation is what we need on these forums.
Whenver someone tries something, i will never scold them. Experimentation is what brought us the MDS light, 25 cent fan mod, the overly complex no code fan mod, the fuse 17 cabin switch, shaving of the moldings, etc

I say to each there own and we just have fun watching everyone try new things

None of this post was sad in anger. Im a very easy going person and I typed this with a smile

So..."Cant we all just get along?"

[boggart]

I don't think anyone is arguing really. But i do think there will be people who put in a lower temp tstat and trash their engine because of it. DCX engineers have told us so, why should we not believe them. The only question will be will the customer a.) do the right thing and own up and accept responsiblity, or will they b.) change the tstat out before taking it in to the shop and claim warranty repair, or c.) take option B and still badmouth DC for having inferior engines even though they were told time and time again not do do the mod.

If everyone chooses A. and accepts their own fate and agrees to claim responsiblity then I think everyone who wants to run a little better should do it. I would just hate to see DC get black eyes over thrashed engines a couple of years down the line (thats at least how long I think it would be before anyone sees any real impact)

[createdbyone]

oh i wont have a warrenty in a few weeks, so i dont think i should be in this discussion

[Guest]

I agree with MagnumSXT. I am not posting any of this to get a rise out of anyone, or to shake my finger at them. Just to let all those who may be unaware that there ARE warnings about this directly from those that designed and built the cars.

I think experimentation is the key to unlocking real performance from any car, but when you're told directly that this one thing can and WILL cause serious, permanent damage to your engine... it is a warning that should be heeded.

[DawsonMagnum]

I don't think anyone is arguing really. But i do think there will be people who put in a lower temp tstat and trash their engine because of it. DCX engineers have told us so, why should we not believe them.

We need to be careful with hyperbole. Unless I missed something, DCX engineers have NOT told us that putting in a lower temp t-stat will "trash" an engine. I have seen comments from the SRT people saying that they aren't necessary and that they might cause faster engine wear, but not that they will kill the motor:

4. Running temps: Adam said that this is a big misconception. The SRTs do not run hot. They are running at the temp which provides the most amount of power without decreasing engine wear. He said he wished the actual temp gauge was changed so the normal running temp. was in the middle or lower rather than the upper end to avoid this unwarranted concern. He said using a 180/190 tstat is not needed.
...
DISCLAIMER: These comments are merely my interpretation of what Adam and I discussed and by no means discounts anyone else's opinion or current mod. choices.

And the intimations made in the post (and it is a post, not an "article") on srt8oc.com are NOT from DCX. They are from "a local Mopar Performance Shop". I'm not saying the info isn't TRUE, but it is not, as they say, from the horse's mouth. And even if what they're saying is all 100% true, do we have any evidence that it will damage the engine? I admittedly don't have much knowledge of blow-by, so forgive me if there is obvious precedence on its detrimental effects on engine logevity.

And last, but not least, is that all the "official" comments we've (or at least that I've seen) been seeing have been from SRT people about SRT engines, not RT engines. It stands to reason that the same things may apply, but we don't know this.