"FrankenBean" - The rebuild starts now...

[CoolVanilla]

While we are still waiting for the results of the "what happened", we're also proceeding down the "what's next" path. That's what this thread is about... what's next.

Goals

1. Find out just what a properly built, all motor, stock stroke and stock bore 5.7 can do.
2. Build for the future. Lets overbuild today, to ensure we can play later.
3. Not reinvent the wheel; if there are parts that will work already out there, lets use them!
4. Not break the bank. We're not talking cheep here, but we're also not talking huge money either. Lets see what we can do on a working man's budget.

Here is the proposed build list

For sure:

• Utilize the stock 5.7 block
  • Why? Simple, we have an opportunity here to see what a properly built 5.7 is actually capable of. Will this be a 700hp NA motor? Nah... but it will be a motor capable of handing some serious all motor power and a proper PCM tune should the software become available one day. Also, she'll be built capable of handing nitrous or some forced induction should the desire strike someday (no plans for this though).
• A new stock 6.1 crank
  
  • The stock 6.1L crankshaft is a forged crankshaft. One of our goals is to overbuild for strength, and to not reinvent the wheel or break the bank. A stock 6.1 shaft fits that mold perfectly.
• Custom one-off forged Diamond pistons.
  
  • These pistons are being forged and cut to a FRI proprietary spec. Should they prove to function as we think they will, these will be turned into a stock part for inclusion in a lower block kit FRI plans to sell to those of us interested in crossing the all motor 400rwhp barrier.
• Custom Eagle H-beam connecting rods;
  
  • Just like pistons, these are a custom forge for now, but if all goes well, these will be part of the kit.
• The same concept FRI camshaft I had in the old block.
  
  • I'm in love with this cam, plain and simple. When FRI productizes it and releases details, you guys will see why. But, as a sneak peak, take a look at these horsepower and torque curves on a non-learned, totally stupid PCM!
  • 
• The same FRI Street heads
  
  • These were probably beat up real good when my old motor went, so they may need to be reworked. Either way, though, I'll be running the FRI Street heads, which are shaved down .03 to bump the compression upwards around 10.5:1 and that have been flow benched out at around 320/240@.050.
• The same Dynatech headers
  
  • No brainer here to run long tubes. Why not 'tuned' or port matched like the Kooks? (1) price and (2) in my personal opinion, the application doesn't demand them. I know this is a divisive issue but I'll fall back to reason (1) as it is in keeping with the overall goal of this build.
• A new stock 5.7 intake
  
  • We are taking no chances on this as there is a strong possibility there is stuff up in my current one we just can't blow out.
• Updated 5/4: An ATI 5% under drive pully.
  
  • The stock 5.7 balancer has been rated to 6300rpm. Today, we can't approach that RPM without some serious PCM/TCM trickery; something I don't think can commonly be done. But, again in keeping with the overbuild goal, the last thing we want is to get some tuning software fresh outta the gate and have a balancer blow up on us.
  • My friend 1bad4dr has hooked me up big time and has this balancer in route to me now. Thank you good sir!
  • Why 5% as opposed to a 4% over or 17% under? My personal preference; I actually would like something as close to stock without going over. As of this moment, it would seem the only option is the 5%.
• An aftermarket fuel controller (see question 2 below)
  
  • Someday, should software ever come out, this piece is expendable. Today, however, we need something to sit between the MAP sensor and PCM. Otherwise, lean conditions are most likely to propagate, and idle problems are for sure. A properly tuned aftermarket fuel controller should relieve both of these concerns as issues.
• A bung welded in for a wide band AF sensor, in prep for the HawkEye; a unit that allows the DashHawk to datalog and display wide band data.
• 6.1 injectors. Since I'm adding a fuel controller, I want to have more fuel than I need avail to me and the tuning. The controller will allow us to dial out fuel should we need to, and the 6.1 injectors will allow us to add more if we show we need that instead.

Optional Addons: These are items I plan to add if finances allow, but don't have anything to do with the "get on the road" requirement.

• The HEMI Shop 5.7 to 6.1 ignition coil conversion. Not sold on this idea yet, but wanted to throw it out there for comment.

Questions

1. The most likely balancer would be the ATI under drive. I'm hoping for another alternative actually; I'm not thrilled at the idea of maintaining the ATI (yes they are maintenance items!) nor do I think an under drive is the best idea. We have contacted a couple other well known mfgs and are awaiting their response. Anyone have any comments/suggestions?
   1. Updated! See above.
2. The two fuel controllers I'm considering are the SMT6 and PSC1. The SMT6 is very powerful, but its unclear all those features work with our LXs. Neither allows an advance of timing (something I'd really like to be able to do). Also, I'd like to see a better resolution; I think the SMT6 is at 200RPM and the PSC1 is at 500RPM. Anyone know for sure?

So there we have it; the FrankenBean is born. Please do feel free to comment/question anything here. If I can answer I will, if not I'll get the answer. See something you don't like? Lets discuss it now...

[armadillo]

I am looking forward to seeing how this goes, any idea what that "working man's budget number will be (ballpark of course)?

[mikespy]

That torque line is purrdieee!!

[gotls1]

Sounds like this should be a real stout runner J. Can't wait.



Is it done yet?







How 'bout now?





Now?

[DaddyGoFast]

Keep up updated Bro! I am pulling for ya!

This time, LOTS and LOTS of pics. Every step, every way, pics...

:-)

I will be living vicariously through you!

[gremlinsteve]

i dont think we cana ctually add anything to that post other that this...we shall post up costs, for no reason other than letting it be know what this deal will run the average joe...

there are so many ways this can be done, so maybe we can throw costs of added "options" in also?

would everyone like to see that? anything else?

steve

[1bad4dr]

Looks to be an impressive build.......... I am excited for you CV.

[36 chambers]

good luck!!!!

[Junior]

Hey Jason, I've been silently following all your recent adventures, and a bunch of older ones, too, but I'm watching this one closely, and I'm really going to try to dig in and keep up as it comes together...

Keep doing what you're doing, man! I admire the pioneers, and that's you buddy.

[hyperbolic]

Another well thought out and organized plan as usuall. Have you given thought to a modified or replacement throttle body (I don't know if anything is available or desired)?

It's going to be great to track your progress and results. Good luck in keeping it withen your budget.

[MattRobertson]

there are so many ways this can be done, so maybe we can throw costs of added "options" in also?

Yes!

I too, am excited for you Jason. You've got a great bunch of guys backing you up. most of those parts are absolutely drool-worthy.

[Meister]

Really solid, very sound, reasoned approach all the way through, Jason. Including ditching your present "snake-bit" intake manifold.

I'm surprised you could even find reference to ATI's "10% underdrive" crankshaft pulley. The last *many* times I tried to find it it was nowhere to be found, including at the major re-sellers, Summit Racing in particular. Reason being I purchased a quote "10% underdrive pulley" many moons ago when I was gathering parts for my cam upgrade. When it arrived it appeared to be *larger* in diameter than my stock pulley, and when I put the tape to it it was, in fact, about a quarter inch larger in diameter, measured at the belt contact surface.

Needless to say I was less than pleased. When I went online and checked it was like something from a spy movie - gone were all references to an underdrive pulley. The very same part number was now being touted as a 4% *over*drive pulley. Which is what mine is. So it's costing me power to spin the accessories faster, from a higher gear, but saving me power through effective vibration control, so it's likely a wash powerwise.

So you may have some very old info there. At the least, if ATI has actually finally produced a true underdrive pulley, the 4% overdrive unit that I'm running has been available for many months. You'll have no problem getting it, and thus all your concerns re. underdrive are non-applicable.

Re. my cryogenically-treated half shafts, I've not spared the whip, and my new drag radials are a mean combo. Tire & wheel on each side total less than 40 pounds, so they'll spin right up, they're making just under a foot of contact at each wheel, and the new special gummy compound feels like an art gum eraser. I've launched with the new mid-stall converter at everywhere from idle to 3100 rpm or so and the half shafts are hanging tough.

But no one has broken a 5.7 half shaft yet. Thus this precaution may be pure over-kill on my part.

For the peace of mind it brings, however, I'm glad that I've had them treated.

All the best, my friend, as you forge your way into a new frontier. I'll help in any way I can, so don't hesitate to holler if you need anything.

[Jim]

Sounds like a hell of a project... can't wait to see it all together!

[moparman53]

This sounds exciting. A kickass 5.7, all motor.

[CoolVanilla]

Have you given thought to a modified or replacement throttle body (I don't know if anything is available or desired)?

Hmm... what did you have in mind HB? I can't really recall any discussion here of such an idea. Got somethin I should consider?

I'm surprised you could even find reference to ATI's "10% underdrive" crankshaft pulley.

Actually, so was I Jim. I'll call ATI tomorrow and try to get some kind of confirmation on the phone one way or another.

If it is confirmed to now be a 10% under, am I justified in being concerned? I can only vaguely recall hearing something about the under drive being a problem with these Hemis (on the trucks?) But I'd like a little more than my recollection to go on. If its an overdrive like yours, well then its a moot point.

As for the maintenance; how concerned should I be? Having installed one successfully yourself Jim, I'd like your thoughts on this.

Re. my cryogenically-treated half shafts...But no one has broken a 5.7 half shaft yet. Thus this precaution may be pure over-kill on my part.

Ahh I see. For some reason I'd swear I'd read somewhere that these were breaking in the 5.7s too. But its entirely possible I've got my memory mixed on this one. Perhaps I ought to not borrow trouble where none already exists.

I was at the Sharks game tonight (hockey) and thus didn't catch your voicemail until just a few minutes ago. I appreciate the effort though my friend.

Thanks everyone for the good thoughts on the build. I'm actually starting to get excited about it. I think its got some real potential to both run with the big boys as well as run for a long time to come. Please do keep the comments and suggestions coming!