Baby got a new rack... steering rack that is. Still got the clunk... HELP please

**carchitect** · 06-13-2009, 02:41 AM

Well I installed the "high performance" steering gear found in the R/T^2 LX's and Daytona Chargers.

The front suspension started getting kinda loud a couple months after my Pedders install. On the recommendation of the shop who did the work and took a look at the car when I brought it to them, I started to replace to the inner and outer tie rods. I just decided to do the whole set with Moog replacements. Got them off, then I found that the part of the clunk was in the steering rack, it felt like it had lots of looseness or play when it was detached from the tie rods. Okay... I've been meaning to upgrade my steering rack to the higher performance version anyway. This was as good a time as any. Ordered the part form MPSC came a week and a half later. And I installed it today, as well as transferred over my Pedders' bumpsteer bushings. Which required the use of a large diameter copper pipe, a piece of wood, and a large c-clamp to push them out. That took a little bit of figuring and searching as I knew I had the right pipe size around the house but it took a little while to find it.

A little bit of a snag came up when I was buttoning up the steering linkage. The pinch bolt groove on the new rack is 180" from the old rack. No problem, unbolt and rotate the intermediate linkage around and slide it into place. Of course it wasn't that easy. There was a stamped tab that interfered with it being flipped. Nothing 30 seconds with a drill and sharp bit couldn't take care of with a little filing to really smooth the inside out so it wouldn't snag on something.

Got that all fixed up and I was a moron and I didn't pay attention as close attention to the orientation of the steering wheel vs the rack position, the wheel was rotated about 60* ('m assuming a proper alignment would have fixed that but I wanted to make sure). The clockspring was acting a little goofy and the ESP/BAS lights came on. After thinking about it for a minute I decided I would disconnect the steering linkage so that I could straighten out the wheel. I then used my trusty MK I EYEBALL to adjust the toe so the wheels were straight with the steering wheel using the rear wheels as reference for parallel after I reattached it. That got rid of the ESP/BAS light and the car tracks really straight.

Impressions of this gear... WOW a lot better, it's gonna break in a little but it's the same level of change in steering response/feedback that I experienced when I got out of my hand-me-down Buick LeSabre and into the Charger.

I still have the clunk though.:confused: It's about 30% better, although I'm sure the loose (as in no longer needed, because it was replaced with Pedders adjustable camber bushings) upper control arm nut that I removed from near the driver side hood hinge helped a little. Turns out the tech who did the work didn't account for all the nuts that were supposed to come out of the car. But it is still there when I go over sharp bumps.

At this point I'm gonna pull off the front sway bar to make sure it isnt either the bushings or the endlinks (the clunk will go away if it is either of those). If that's not it it's the ball joint on the tension strut where it connects to the knuckle. I definitely will not be able to get that one warrantied because of the Pedders bushing in that piece, and if I do they'll probably toss the Pedder's bushing which is not an option. So if it is the tension strut I'm gonna have to buy new ones, pull the old tension struts and then take them somewhere to the large radius rod bushings swapped from the old over to the new. I don't know though... the boots on those joints look good (no grease, or rips). What could have caused them to go bad? Added stress from the lowering? An important piece of information here is that the shop who did the install originally forgot to install the radius rod bushing and I had them look at the clunk and install the bushing at the same time. The clunk became a lot worse, and due to polyurethane's tendency to magnify road noise I have a feeling that it is in fact the tension strut ball joint.

While this has been a poor experience with a mod I gotta say I've learned a hell of a lot about the front suspension/steering on these cars and have gotten comfortable to the point where I'm able to replace parts and work on the suspension with the help of the SM and not worry about sending myself into Lake Michigan.

So does anyone have any suggestions? I know there have been a ton of the "clunk threads" lately but I think I have enough history and facts in here that more experienced person could tell me exactly what I need to do, or at least confirm my plan of attack.

**formerice** · 06-13-2009, 09:03 AM

I did the complete Pedders bushings swap and still had some front end noise. It was the tension struts! It was more of a rattle, sounds like your driving a rattletrap. Someday I've got to press out the Pedders bushings in the old tension struts and install in my new tension struts, but now the car is tight and handles beautifully.

**carchitect** · 06-13-2009, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by formerice

I did the complete Pedders bushings swap and still had some front end noise. It was the tension struts! It was more of a rattle, sounds like your driving a rattletrap. Someday I've got to press out the Pedders bushings in the old tension struts and install in my new tension struts, but now the car is tight and handles beautifully.

Yup, I did a lot of learning about how all this stuff works and I was pretty disappointed that a lot of the Pedders bushings (mostly in the front end I think) attach or are pressed into assemblies with "sealed for life" joints.

It is a lot better than what it was, but rattles bug the shiat outta me. Plus I don't really find them acceptable on the ~3 year old ~30k mile car. Warrantied or not, I'm getting it fixed.

**FL3JM** · 06-13-2009, 11:13 AM

Are you sure its not the swaybar? I had some serious clunking going on, changed the swaybar and it was all fixed!

**carchitect** · 06-13-2009, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by FL3JM

Are you sure its not the swaybar? I had some serious clunking going on, changed the swaybar and it was all fixed!

Well that's the first thing I said I'm gonna try as it's free to remove the sway bar and end links to see if the sound goes away. If the sound persists when the swaybar is off I know it's not the sway bar.

**Fargo59** · 06-13-2009, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by FL3JM

Are you sure its not the swaybar? I had some serious clunking going on, changed the swaybar and it was all fixed!

sway bar, or sway bar bushings? most common concerns on the front end of an LX have been tie rods, tension struts, and sway bar bushings.

**carchitect** · 06-13-2009, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by fargo59

sway bar, or sway bar bushings? most common concerns on the front end of an LX have been tie rods, tension struts, and sway bar bushings.

I know that's not to me but let me clarify that I would replace the endlinks and or the sway bar bushings.

Posted via LXFMobile

**BIG SMOOTH** · 06-13-2009, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by fargo59

sway bar, or sway bar bushings? most common concerns on the front end of an LX have been tie rods, tension struts, and sway bar bushings.

Well, I got new SB bushings, and a new rack, rattle persists.

Next for me is Tension struts and beefier (BWoody) SB end links.

Let's see if the rattle exists after that....

**Nuclearjack** · 06-13-2009, 09:01 PM

the front end clunk is making me wish I never seen my car on the dealer lot. Im not Independently wealthy so I cant keep throwing money at it hoping it stops some day.

**sidetrack** · 06-14-2009, 05:08 PM

Torn tension strut bushings can cause clunking. They are easy to see with wheel off.
Here is a pic of my driver side.

From what you wrote, I think you said you changed the upper control arm.
Recheck the upper control arm bolts, the control arm bolts that are in the engine bay.
Mine once got loose and caused a clunking noise.

**carchitect** · 06-14-2009, 05:25 PM

Originally Posted by sidetrack

Torn tension strut bushings can cause clunking. They are easy to see with wheel off.
Here is a pic of my driver side.

From what you wrote, I think you said you changed the upper control arm.
Recheck the upper control arm bolts, the control arm bolts that are in the engine bay.
Mine once got loose and caused a clunking noise.

If that is the bushing that is in the tension strut it has been replaced with a Pedders radius rod bushing, in fact the clunking became louder after that. How common is it for the ball joint end of the tension strut to go bad? That is one question I haven't been able to find an answer to, and if I were to get one it would help me a lot in how I approach the problem.

The upper control arm has Pedders adjustable camber bushings in it. Those use a different hardware setup then the stock setup, there is no bolt in the engine bay to tighten.

**sidetrack** · 06-14-2009, 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by carchitect

How common is it for the ball joint end of the tension strut to go bad?

I can't recall anyone replacing their tension strut because of a bad ball joint. I had to replace my lower control arm because of a ball joint boot seal tear, but never seen anyone have a problem with the tension strut ball joint.

If you can find a dealer with chassis ears, that would really help pinpoint your noise.

**carchitect** · 06-14-2009, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by sidetrack

I can't recall anyone replacing their tension strut because of a bad ball joint. I had to replace my lower control arm because of a ball joint boot seal tear, but never seen anyone have a problem with the tension strut ball joint.

If you can find a dealer with chassis ears, that would really help pinpoint your noise.

I would be kinda pissed if it was the lower ball joint... isn't that part of the knuckle?
Although I don't think it is the lower ball joint as I don't think I'm getting the sounds associated with a bad one of those. Plus the boot is still sealed, no sign of grease leakage.

I'm hoping that it ends up being the end links or sway bar bushings.

As far as the chassis ears go I will give those a shot when I get a chance to remove the sway bar and endlinks to see if the clunk persists. If it does I will find one with a set of chassis ears and let them at it.

**swobosf** · 06-14-2009, 06:20 PM

How much was the upgraded steering rack from MPSC? Are any other parts needed besides the rack and bump steer bushings? I have been thinking of doing this mod myself.