Great Intake Face Off Post Exhaust - RESULTS

**CoolVanilla** · 08-13-2005, 06:58 PM

Test Information
Date: 8/12/05
Dyno Time: 12:00 – 5pm
Dyno Temp Range: 97 – 106 degrees F
Dyno Location: SVS Automotive Research and Development Dept, Sacramento (www.svsrnd.com)
Dyno Driver and test administrator: Bob Crespo of SVS R and D
Dynamometer: Superflow AutoDyn SF 840 Chassis
Dyno Setup: All tests were run with a fan blowing from the front of the vehicle as well as across the tail area.
Dyno Raw Data, WinDyn reader and Quicktime Movies of the ScanGauge during three different dyno runs: https://mydata.datadepositbox.com/SS...ad12294648416e
(enter your username, no password is required)

Results Summary

Lets get right to the numbers:

The following statements are my own. I’ve based these thoughts on 50+ dyno runs made with various hardware, conversations I’ve had with performance experts, vendors and manufacturers, comments made by other members, general feelings expressed by those present at the dyno and at the track and my own previous experiences. So, I want there to be no misunderstanding: what I’m about to say are my own opinions. The only facts we have are the numbers above. You are invited to draw your own conclusions, however I suggest you do so with care and attempt to realize the only thing we can know for sure is what the numbers show for this particular group of variables.

The results are simple. Aftermarket intakes for my 2005 Magnum RT do not offer any benefit, and in fact can adversely affect performance. This statement holds true for both pre as well as post exhaust results.

I’ve carefully checked and rechecked the numbers in the chart above. These numbers are accurate and I invite anyone so inclined to double-check me against the raw data you can download above. I highlighted in green the average that produced the highest hp and torque numbers. As you can see, these numbers were the result of a stock intake after a reset. However, it is extremely important to realize at this point that statistically speaking, these highlighted numbers represent no difference when compared to the stock intake before a reset, the Volant with no reset with fuse 17 installed, the Volant with no reset with fuse 17 removed and the Aircharger with no reset and fuse 17 removed..

To me, this is very important. It proves a number of key points:

1) Resetting the computer (PCM specifically) makes zero difference in WOT performance. Before the test, I gave the Volant over 500 miles to “burn in”; remember, Volant states 150 is sufficient. Also, I had over 2000 miles on the exhaust. The tests show that wiping the PCM of this “burn in” does not have any effect. IMHO, there in fact is no burn in.

2) Pulling fuse 17 does not affect performance.

3) Resetting the computer and/or pulling fuse 17 does not put the transmission into any sort of “limp mode”.

4) The horsepower gains seen when comparing the pre and post exhaust results (approx 10hp) are solely do to the exhaust. The intakes make zero difference in either case.

These ascertains are bolstered by the runs made by MattRobertson and Calabahn after my tests. You’ll find these numbers just under the first bold line in the chart. Two different cars, with two different intakes, both having thousands of miles on their respective exhausts and intakes showed little to no difference between themselves as well as when compared to all the data derived from my Magnum.

Now look at the Airaid. While statistically speaking the difference is minimal, you can see that this particular intake actually degraded performance. The only reason I can come up with for this is the relative filter size. It does appear slightly smaller and therefore might actually introduce a restriction. This, however, is just an observation on my part. In truth I do not have an explanation.

Lastly, take a look at the rewired numbers. This test was done because of the interest expressed here: http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=15895 After the rewire, the following was observed by those present:

1) There may have been a slightly smoother idle. The engine appeared to shake less. However, the difference within the car was not enough to be noticed.

2) The pitch of the engine seemed to raise. No hard core proof of that, but more than one person commented that, at idle the pitch seemed a touch higher.

3) Performance: yikes. Again while minimal, there was definitely a drop off in performance at WOT. For me, the smoother idle that may or may not exist in no way justifies this mod. Lower performance and a sure fire way to piss off your dealership equals a bad idea.

Oh yeah, one more thing: gotls1’s Camaro is for real (results below the second line in the chart). Bob stated it was the best performance numbers he’s seen on his dyno for a Camaro LS1. Watching that thing rev up and get stronger and stronger was a thrill. It’s also important to realize it provided a sort of validation for the dyno itself. Gotls1 stated the last time she ran she got 369hp, but with a locked converter. To get 365 without the lock in 106 deg F weather most certainly should remove any concern that the dyno itself might have been an issue.

Well folks that’s it. Take these results and use them as you see fit. I fully understand and expect there to be dissenting opinions and feelings. For me, however, this matter is closed. Until the two items I list below are addressed, I think we’re basically stuck:

1) Nothing short of a full programmer is going to unlock this engine. Take a look at the ignition timing. We need a programmer that will allow us to advance that timing at WOT. Until we can do that, we are completely hamstrung.

2) New software for our transmissions. As you can see in the raw data, this transmission is just plain weird. It shifts differently from run to run. It downshifts at odd RPMs. The code inside the TCM kills performance between gears, apparently to smooth the shift and to limit stress on the gears (thanks Mercedes) ect…

I hope you’ve found this as educational as I have. When you boil it all away, these kinds of mods (exhaust and intake) are worth every penny if they help add to the experience of owning your LX. I love my Zoommers. Every time she fires up, I get this grin I can’t hide. I love the way the K&N intake looks and sounds. I really enjoy popping that hood and showing off the Hemi and that purdy K&N under there. I take more pride in my Magnum because I know I’ve tweaked it to my tastes. For me, these reasons by themselves are enough to more than justify the purchase of the components. When a programmer becomes available, maybe then performance gains will help add to the value I’ve already got.

It was great hanging with the gang again, and meeting a couple of the young LX’ers (lil miss magnumdude and young Calabahn). We will be putting together another M&G soon, and yes it will be on a weekend so more of ya working stiff’s can attend.

PS: We did make it to the track, but the temps prevented any real comparisons from being drawn from the previous Face Off. Track temps were right around 100degrees until 9pm when it “cooled” off to about 92. gotls1 made a run of 14.7 AND out 60’d a C5 Vette, but that was probably because he was sitting there spinning instead of movin down the track

Lots of video was taken and hopefully we’ll have that up for all to see soon. In the mean time, enjoy the pics below.

The CV Mobile ready to go

Shot of the dyno computer

During a swap. From left to right: Bob, CoolVanilla, MattRoberston, magnumdude, lil miss magnumdude, Calabahn

Kaps installing the stock intake. Hey nice shirt CV!

CV, MR, and Cala trying to figure out why these intakes aren’t yielding 400+ hp….

MR’s DarthHemi strapped down and ready to run.

Mmmm love Darth’s grill.

Darth’s always watching (anyone see the camera?)

Bob getting Calabahn’s baby ready to run

Get ‘er done! Calabahns’ ready to roll!

Move over boys, its the ladies time to play

**CoolVanilla** · 08-13-2005, 07:00 PM

Love the plate.

Now she’s just showing off

Ok… who let the Chevy get in the shot?

Enough of this heat! Lets go eat!

Don’t forget to download the Quicktime vids of the ScanGauge thru an entire run if you’d like to see the timing curve. Find the link at the top of the first post.

**Northern Rider** · 08-13-2005, 07:12 PM

Thanks, CV and all of you that have worked so hard to put these tests together.

This type of data is very helpful to me as I wait for a real programmer to tune my HemiC for more competition driving.

It's obvious that the original air intake supplies more than enough air for the engine, as it is now configured (my Volant does look neat, though!).

I agree about the wonky shift patterns for the tranny.

Again, a big thanks!

**hemied** · 08-13-2005, 07:27 PM

Big Props to you and everyone who helped do this. Great information.
You guys rock! My wallet thanks you!

**done** · 08-13-2005, 07:37 PM

Great work. Worth the $$

My Mopar looks good, sounds great.

**MattRobertson** · 08-13-2005, 07:53 PM

Once again, CV has given us all a lot of information and a lot of his time and effort. Thanks!

We learned a lot this time. There's really nothing left to argue about, in my opinion.

The running of additional Magnums found consistently similar results. One of those Magnums (mine) had a K&N intake on it that was guaranteed to give me 11 hp. So was I 11 horses over the other Magnums? Read the numbers. The fact that we had a stock Magnum with Zoomers, a Volant'd Magnum with Zoomers and a K&N Typhoon'd Magnum with Zoomers... and we all essentially had the same HP figures... leads me to the same conclusion CV has come to.

Intakes do nothing on this car except look cool and sound louder.

In terms of recovery of their reputation, the ball is now in the park of the manufacturers, and I have to say I am extremely disappointed with K&N in particular: A company that made claims which have been so far proven completely baseless and who, after numerous respectful requests for information explaining where we could have gone wrong, chose to ignore the matter entirely.

**LowGo** · 08-13-2005, 08:03 PM

You guys have to have screwed up somewhere. I'm sure you must have done something wrong. I know that my intake is providing me with more HP than the stock inta.... wait a sec... I still have the stock intake... NEVER MIND!

Seriously... thanks for the info and all the effort. Good job. I don't understand the affect of switching the wires, but that's a discussion for another thread.

**NC-SXT** · 08-13-2005, 08:35 PM

Thanks for all the work. You guys rock. I am now convinced my 360 on my SXT is mere eye and ear candy. Now I can move on.

**hemi_hearse** · 08-13-2005, 09:49 PM

Guess my $400 will go into another Mod! Guys, if you are ever in Dallas, Mi Casa, Su Casa!

**redinorange** · 08-13-2005, 09:54 PM

Great work. Excellently prepared results...

**fnkychkn** · 08-13-2005, 10:37 PM

great write-up CV. results pretty much what you expected? thanks to all who gave their time and effort to provide all this information to our members. you guys rock

**MAGNUM22** · 08-13-2005, 11:00 PM

Thanks for all the great info.

**magnumdude** · 08-14-2005, 12:13 AM

Funny, everybody keeps saying thanks for all the hard work......Me and lil miss 'dude had a blast!!!!!!!!! She didn't want to run across the street for a slice of pizza because she thought she might miss a run!! Great seeing "y'all" again. Hears to old friends and new. (calabahn jr and Mrs CV).

**Nimcosi** · 08-14-2005, 01:06 AM

I am intrigued when comparing these numbers with the original GCAITO.

**JustinHEMI04** · 08-14-2005, 01:18 AM

Both of these threads have been very informative and eye opening. I hope the manufacturers get a hold of these results and provide us with some insight.

Justin