Options and opinions on supercharger safety, discuss.

[1fastsedan]

So I've been running my 8 pound Vortech kit on motor with heads, cam, and a stock bottom end for over 6 months now. I've seen every supercharger kit produced toast at least one motor. I want to discuss some supercharger safety tips and tricks. Below is what has worked well for me. This is my personal experience and opinion, not any hard cold facts other than its worked well for me.

Blown motors come from 2 sources, heat and detonation.

HEAT: For those that don't know, compression generates heat and raises intake air charge temperature. You're motor then compresses all that hot air again, generating more heat. That heat then closes the gap on the piston rings causing them to go solid and pop off the ring land.

HEAT HELP: good tune, aftercooler, and water/meth injection (chemical intercooler)

DETONATION: With increased compression comes increased likelihood of premature ignition within the cylinder. These uncontrolled ignition events can easily break pistons.

DETONATION HELP: good tune (especially at part throttle), aftermarket fuel rails with front crossover and 3/8" fuel line if running 8 pounds of boost or more

I consider the aftermarket fuel rails and water/meth kit essential additions to stock bottom ends with boost.

[MOL SRT-8]

i have to agree completely.

[EWRSRT]

I am very intrigued by the water/meth injection. Can I ask when you have yours set to spray? Does it only spray at WOT?

Thanks, Wally.

[MOL SRT-8]

I am very intrigued by the water/meth injection. Can I ask when you have yours set to spray? Does it only spray at WOT?

Thanks, Wally.

my meth/water kit is run off boost, it starts at 2lbs. and is full on by 5lbs.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

So I've been running my 8 pound Vortech kit on motor with heads, cam, and a stock bottom end for over 6 months now. I've seen every supercharger kit produced toast at least one motor. I want to discuss some supercharger safety tips and tricks. Below is what has worked well for me. This is my personal experience and opinion, not any hard cold facts other than its worked well for me.

Blown motors come from 2 sources, heat and detonation.

HEAT: For those that don't know, compression generates heat and raises intake air charge temperature. You're motor then compresses all that hot air again, generating more heat. That heat then closes the gap on the piston rings causing them to go solid and pop off the ring land.

HEAT HELP: good tune, aftercooler, and water/meth injection (chemical intercooler)

DETONATION: With increased compression comes increased likelihood of premature ignition within the cylinder. These uncontrolled ignition events can easily break pistons.

DETONATION HELP: good tune (especially at part throttle), aftermarket fuel rails with front crossover and 3/8" fuel line if running 8 pounds of boost or more

I consider the aftermarket fuel rails and water/meth kit essential additions to stock bottom ends with boost.

I agree...also a air-to-air intercooler has been proven to help with the intake air temps (Heat). It actually performed way better than the aftercooler. Might want to look into that route. This would add to your security blanket.

IMO, a built motor is like a insurance policy. I would feel better to "Have one and not need it vs. need it and not have one" ....:beerchug: Thats why I jumped on one the 1st chance I had.

[Redfox0099]

The Water Methanol kits I sell (and use on both my Turbo Diesel and S/Ced Hemi) are injected based on the amount of boost the controller sees.

On the standard controller there are two dials, the 1st one is the initial starting point for the controller to come on at 10% volumetric spray of the Methanol.

The Digital controller is a little more tricky and goes off the Injector Duty Cycle and can be more precise when it comes to the injection...this is the one I use in my vehicles.


I am going to start another Water/Methanol Group Buy soon, yall stay tuned (tuned...get it) :)


I crack myself up sometimes.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

The Water Methanol kits I sell (and use on both my Turbo Diesel and S/Ced Hemi) are injected based on the amount of boost the controller sees.

On the standard controller there are two dials, the 1st one is the initial starting point for the controller to come on at 10% volumetric spray of the Methanol.

The Digital controller is a little more tricky and goes off the Injector Duty Cycle and can be more precise when it comes to the injection...this is the one I use in my vehicles.


I am going to start another Water/Methanol Group Buy soon, yall stay tuned (tuned...get it) :)


I crack myself up sometimes.

LOL...:beerchug:

[Redfox0099]

LOL...:beerchug:

Thanks folks, I'll be here all night..... be sure to tip the waitresses.

Posted via LXFMobile

[1fastsedan]

I agree...also a air-to-air intercooler has been proven to help with the intake air temps (Heat). It actually performed way better than the aftercooler. Might want to look into that route. This would add to your security blanket.
I haven't seen any advantage with air to air over air to water coolers. I think its more of a personal preference kind of thing. You definitely should have one, but I haven't seen one type outperform the other.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

I haven't seen any advantage with air to air over air to water coolers. I think its more of a personal preference kind of thing. You definitely should have one, but I haven't seen one type outperform the other.

heres One.....

http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=141169&page=5

[SRT8U]

I haven't seen any advantage with air to air over air to water coolers. I think its more of a personal preference kind of thing. You definitely should have one, but I haven't seen one type outperform the other.
Agreed!

[MOL SRT-8]

i am sticking with what i have.

http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t339/molsrt8/OCTTOBER%20PHOTOS/photoshootoct08004.jpg

[1fastsedan]

heres One.....

http://www.lxforums.com/board/showthread.php?t=141169&page=5
I'm confused. I always run only a few degrees above ambient with air to water set-up, so what's the advantage. Plus, you lose boost with air to air so you have to generate more heat by spinning a smaller pulley to make the same power. I know that GSM's air to water cooler sucked, but that doesn't mean all of them do in general.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad that you like yours and it works well for you, but its not the only option. Its your opinion that they work better, fine. In my experience they're about the same and are both viable options for safety.

[Hemi31]

I'm confused. I always run only a few degrees above ambient with air to water set-up, so what's the advantage. Plus, you lose boost with air to air so you have to generate more heat by spinning a smaller pulley to make the same power. I know that GSM's air to water cooler sucked, but that doesn't mean all of them do in general.
The air to air doesn't lose much boost.Cruising around town temps are not much different but WOT the A/A runs cooler,especially once your at the top of second and third gear......but remember I am talking 10-12 psi not 6-8.

[1fastsedan]

The air to air doesn't lose much boost.Cruising around town temps are not much different but WOT the A/A runs cooler,especially once your at the top of second and third gear......but remember I am talking 10-12 psi not 6-8.
That's why I put the ice in aftercooler coolant at the track. :)

[STREET LIFE R/T]

That's why I put the ice in aftercooler coolant at the track. :)

i guess it does come down to what the person wants, but all the extra work of adding 2 heat exchangers or putting Ice in the coolant, etc... bottom line the key is to keep the sucker from going boom from heat right........so if you can get the same if not better results by going with a air to air setup only..IMO, I think its better.

Your right about the GSM aftercooler being crap...But call Speedfactory and ask them why they are running a air-to-air setup on there Vortech blower instead of the water to air.

[Johnparts]

On the street an Air/air intercooler is by far the better set-up as far as efficiency goes especially on a higher boost application it's also a matter of Size the air/water set-up on the vortech is good for low boost but if you plan on going higher you need a Larger aftercooler then you have the problem of where are you going to put the Big unit you would need. The new Pro-Charger ho kit has an 8X18X4 core and it can suck alot of heat out of the air.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

This is my core size.. 10.5" X 26" X 4" with 3 inch end tanks..overall length. 36 inches.

[8yourM5]

I'm confused. I always run only a few degrees above ambient with air to water set-up, so what's the advantage. Plus, you lose boost with air to air so you have to generate more heat by spinning a smaller pulley to make the same power. I know that GSM's air to water cooler sucked, but that doesn't mean all of them do in general.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad that you like yours and it works well for you, but its not the only option. Its your opinion that they work better, fine. In my experience they're about the same and are both viable options for safety.

I agree with you my GS after cooler sucked with out meth temps around 140 but you have to remember I have the blower maxed out on a 426. WHen I added the meth I lost all KNock and dropped the temps down to 102. picked up 63 HP and made WOT very very safe..
Also about the fuel rails I was running out of fuel at 7 psi I upped the boost a pump to a 40 amp and added the fuel rails and boom problem solved. I still think 8 psi is alot for a stock bottem end but your motor seems to be loving it and heads and cam man thats crazy.
How much power did you make on the dyno?

WAter MEth FTW

[8yourM5]

i guess it does come down to what the person wants, but all the extra work of adding 2 heat exchangers or putting Ice in the coolant, etc... bottom line the key is to keep the sucker from going boom from heat right........so if you can get the same if not better results by going with a air to air setup only..IMO, I think its better.

Your right about the GSM aftercooler being crap...But call Speedfactory and ask them why they are running a air-to-air setup on there Vortech blower instead of the water to air.
Last ime i checked injected made a 426 gs blown car in to a front mount but where only able to make 580ish It was on the srt8oc a while back.
I made 663 with the gs aftercooler so its not that crappy.( as long as you use meth too)

[STREET LIFE R/T]

Last ime i checked injected made a 426 gs blown car in to a front mount but where only able to make 580ish It was on the srt8oc a while back.
I made 663 with the gs aftercooler so its not that crappy.( as long as you use meth too)


Your right injected did the work on the car your talking about and the speedfactory charger....We are talking about heat being the problem for our motors and what to do to get rid of it or lower the temps...congrats on your 663, but that does not mean the GS cooler is worth anything..im willing to bet your IAT's are going through the roof. The Meth kit is nothing but a band aid IMO..if you got rid of the GS crap cooler, you would not need a meth kit....

[1fastsedan]

I still think 8 psi is alot for a stock bottem end but your motor seems to be loving it and heads and cam man thats crazy.
How much power did you make on the dyno?
I'm still working on my custom tuning so no current numbers.

The last I pulled was a 550 running 7.5 psi with Vortech's conservative tune, a tiny air filter, no meth, and running out of fuel. I've made some changes since then but we're not done tuning to take advantage of everything.

I hope to have everything ready for some racing after the Spring Festival.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

I'm still working on my custom tuning so no current numbers.

The last I pulled was a 550 running 7.5 psi with Vortech's conservative tune, a tiny air filter, no meth, and running out of fuel. I've made some changes since then but we're not done tuning to take advantage of everything.

I hope to have everything ready for some racing after the Spring Festival.

damn I can't wait to get my car tunned, Im guessing I will be around 570-580 hp for all the mods I have...My fuel setup will handle more than this.

[1fastsedan]

damn I can't wait to get my car tunned, Im guessing I will be around 570-580 hp for all the mods I have...My fuel setup will handle more than this.
Care to share what your fuel set up is?

Mine was pretty easy. Billet Tech fuel rails with both front and back crossovers fed by -6(3/8") fuel line all the way from the passenger basket to the rail. I'm going to do a little write up on the fuel line one of these days. The bottom line is that the stock pump is good for a LOT more fuel volume than the 5/16" fuel line will move.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

Care to share what your fuel set up is?

Mine was pretty easy. Billet Tech fuel rails with both front and back crossovers fed by -6(3/8") fuel line all the way from the passenger basket to the rail. I'm going to do a little write up on the fuel line one of these days. The bottom line is that the stock pump is good for a LOT more fuel volume than the 5/16" fuel line will move.


everything you have, but 2 walbro fuel pumps ..:beerchug:

[hemi nick]

everything you have, but 2 walbro fuel pumps ..:beerchug:

little confused(which isnt hard for me to do),,so you have a total of three fuel pumps, one stock and two after markets??:tinfoilhat:

[STREET LIFE R/T]

little confused(which isnt hard for me to do),,so you have a total of three fuel pumps, one stock and two after markets??:tinfoilhat:

LOL, no..... 2 fuel pumps total,..

The fuel setup is the last stage that im working on as we speak...SRT4 stage II injectors should ship out monday, cpr fuel rails, front and back crossovers, dual walbro in tank fuel pumps...I will be posting some pics once everything is ready to be installed...

[hemi nick]

LOL, no..... 2 fuel pumps total,..

The fuel setup is the last stage that im working on as we speak...SRT4 stage II injectors should ship out monday, billet tech fuel rails, front and back crossovers, dual walbro in tank fuel pumps...I will be posting some pics once everything is ready to be installed...

Cool.. I think whoever is doing the install will find that leaving the stock pump in place and adding just "one" walbro would be simpler, cost effective, and still supply enough fuel for more hp. your motor can handle(ask me how i know:wink:)...

[STREET LIFE R/T]

Cool.. I think whoever is doing the install will find that leaving the stock pump in place and adding just "one" walbro would be simpler, cost effective, and still supply enough fuel for more hp. your motor can handle(ask me how i know:wink:)...

Only reason im taking this route with a big fuel system is because, knowing the person I am...570 hp will become old news and I see myself going higher...I really doubt that this 372 ci will stay in my car...:racing: I see myself with a 440 ci or something along those lines....LOL

[SRT8U]

damn I can't wait to get my car tunned, Im guessing I will be around 570-580 hp for all the mods I have...My fuel setup will handle more than this.
I hope you will be well past 570 with those mods....we just ran 570 rwhp the other day on a customer bone stock SRT8 with the Water to Air intercooler. You shoudl be beyond that w Stroker, heads, cam, exhaust, longtubes etc.

[hemi nick]

Only reason im taking this route with a big fuel system is because, knowing the person I am...570 hp will become old news and I see myself going higher...I really doubt that this 372 ci will stay in my car...:racing: I see myself with a 440 ci or something along those lines....LOL

Aha.....I'm picking up what you're putting down....makes sense now:beerchug:

[SRT8U]

One other note on the Water to Air vs Air to Air debate...

They both work great and do the job, as Adam said it comes down as much to personal preference than anything. IMO and our experience there is no need to change from water to air to air to air in order to make more power. We came from the Ford side originally and the common theme there is that you ned to ditch the aftercooler and go Air to Air if you want to make over 450 hp or so. Well we are currently at 850 motor HP and 700+ at the wheels on our Auto Trans Vortech powered Mustang...using the standard Vortech Aftercooler which everyone swore was no good past 500 hp.

I agree on water meth and having an intercooler of some kind. The debate as to which is better though is an endless one...kind of like which Cat Back is best or which CAI is better etc.

[STREET LIFE R/T]

I hope you will be well past 570 with those mods....we just ran 570 rwhp the other day on a customer bone stock SRT8 with the Water to Air intercooler. You shoudl be beyond that w Stroker, heads, cam, exhaust, longtubes etc.


I might be right.....

The motor put down 530hp-570tq on a 100 shot of nitrous, Really my goal was 600hp, but if I hit 570-580 I will be happy for now. besides, Im not trying to by a tranny until mid summer,LOL